Topic: Favourite N64 Zelda

If you learn to use time to your advantage, slow it down, speed it up, it's great, especially when you start messing with the side-quests. For dungeons you get shed loads time (assuming you slowed it), so long as you start on day 1, instead of gettin' there sometime on day 2 n headin' in. Whoops.

As for favourite, dunno. I'd have to say Ocarina, but Majora's is a very close second, with Windwaker closely behind (Nintendo Gallery was the best side quest ever, massive).

+1. A once-in-a-lifetime master piece.

"Can I ask a question? What makes you happy? I wonder what makes you happy does it make others happy, too?"

Well i love Majoras Mask because its so deep i cant explain. Truly a Masterpiece, Oot was good but it didn't have that feel of seeing other peoples lives and knowing that the will die if you dont stop the moon, and another thing is on the final day you see some people like the postman staying because its not in his schedule or the guards staying because the commander did not tell them too, And Majora? in terms of evilness Majoras > Ganon because Majora is insane and when is going to kill he makes sure they dont die in peace he leaves them with regrets and makes sure they suffer, and leaves Link to help their souls.
Wow i went deep.

Yep I agree, on Oot I sort of felt the only evil was in Hyrule Castle and It hadn't really spread anywhere else. The people at the Village didn't seem fussed by it. And Majora is better villain in my opinion, more darker, but maybe I see him better because Ganon is used pretty much all the time.

lol, you copied me. XD

I Like Majora's Mask too because of it's darker storyline and the game was underrated where Ocarina is overrated!

Full disclosure, I'm at the 'collecting Zora eggs' bit, but this is a very strong and unpleasant reminder of why I quit Wind Waker. Exploration can be fun; fetch quest where you're never clearly told where to go and what to do are annoying. MM's level design and puzzle also seem far more random and frustrating, and far less like they're difficult, but with the level designer trying to guide you to finding the solution. I largely tried not to use a strategy guide with OOT; with MM I have to pull it up all the time just to know where to go and who to talk to next, let alone figuring out what to do to solve puzzles.

I've come close to throwing my controller at MM a couple times, and very nearly considered just quitting it and moving on to something less annoying. Not because it's a hard game, but because every bit of gameplay I've seen is poorly designed, in spite of an interesting plot and potentially brilliant time-travel system. I have a very strong feeling that my continuing to return to it is more because of my urge to complete it, see the ending, see where it goes, see if it improves, at least say I've beaten it-- and not because it's a fun game that makes me want to play it. About an hour ago, I thought about playing it, but decided not to, because I'll be going to sleep soon.. A great game would've kept me awake.

I guess i have to play majoras mask again. Vc or the disc-release? However me thinks the bosses are pretty puny in Majora and the moonwalking one yeesh that's creepy. The storyline is much deeper in Majora, but the bosses and temples are bad, bland or just to few of them. The replayability is better in Majora i guess. But seriously guys according to all the greatest games lists Ocarina is number one and also imo it is the greatest game ever made. You're epic wrong. Woot. Majora is maybe a close second. Me loves the upsidedown temple and it's music, pure magic.

You used a guide book? Well then I'm sorry you won't beat it, cos it's already beaten you.

Guidebooks are for losers!!!

I don't see how using a guidebook makes he/she a loser? Saying things like that just makes you immature.

Well I feel like a proper loser, if and when I need help with a game. Which is I'm always patient, and then what do you know, I figure it out. I think that's quite mature, as opposed to reaching for help the moment it gets tough. There's no guide book for life (and if there was I wouldn't read it).

Don't get me wrong I wasn't being nasty, I just think its funny someone claiming to 'beat' a game having, in effect, cheated.

@feba: You've put into words what I've always thought about Majora's Mask better than I ever could myself.

I'll just say is & get it over with; I love both Zelda OoT & MM equally... no contest!

Machu, if you go through life without ever seeking help to tell you what your options are or what you can (and should) do next, you are incredibly foolish at best. The entire reason our species is where it is, instead of wallowing in mud, is because we have figured out how to pass on what we know, ways to figure out problems. Every single thing in your house is there because someone said "There is a problem", and then thought of a way to solve it. For example, tin cans and the like were actually around for some decade or so before can openers. Someone thought "well, this is a problem", and found a solution to it in the can opener, which was subsequently widely adopted. Could you imagine how miserable life would be if every single person had to invent their own can opener, their own computer? If everyone had to work with a basic knowledge of levers and fulcrums to build machinery for themselves, instead of relying on what has already been created for them? The idea that life doesn't solve problems for you is just plain wrong; solving problems for other people is the entire basis of human civilization.

In relation to guides in games, yes, if a game has a poorly designed section, I will use a guide. I rarely do, because at least most poorly designed games recognize this, and make themselves largely linear. When a game puts you in a world with very little in the way of proper instruction and expects you to just do everything, that's not a brilliant puzzle solver, that's exactly the kind of "try to combine everything with everything else" approach that nearly killed the point-and-click Adventure genre. When a developer puts in a puzzle that doesn't require some brilliant solution, but rather simply requires you to follow their bizarre logic, that's not a good puzzle, that's just stupid.

For example, to get in the Great Bay I'm currently in, after warping to town Tatl tells me to go to the ocean in the west. When I head that way, I find that I need something that's able to jump over a gate there. The game expects me to take this as "go north, melt the ice in front of a cave, go inside and talk to the guy there, then take item A to an unrelated area you may not have even noticed before, blow it up, and go back to him. After that, you can buy item A from a shop, and take it to this place on the first day to be able to get Epona.". This is hardly turning to a strategy guide 'the moment things get tough'.

Majora's Mask might be a better game if I were a kid with a shorter attention span, the one who didn't mind just tossing a game in for awhile to see what I can do. But as it is, I want to make progress in games. Majora's Mask expects you to find these things and then find something completely unrelated to solve it with. This could be cool if it were done in a clever, time-travel-ly way, but it's not. It's just poor puzzle solving with atmosphere and a teeny bit of stress. Quite frankly, when you compare MM's "try everything everywhere and hopefully you will succeed" method to the "feel free to explore, but here's where you need to go next" demonstrated by... well, every other Zelda game + Okami, Shadow of the Colossus, Grand Theft Auto, Kingdom Hearts, any recent Final Fantasy, No More Heroes, or pretty much any game with even a slightly open world, it falls very flat. "Be patient, try everything, and go everywhere" isn't a brilliant gameplay plan. It's padding the hours of their games. In any other Zelda game, the brilliance is clear in the puzzles, because they're in the puzzles, not getting to them. Majora's Mask feels like they gave up on making puzzles, and instead decided to just make getting around as big of a pain in the ass as they could manage and hope that it would make the game last longer.

If you want to look down on someone for using a strategy guide in a game that doesn't need it, go ahead. If you want to look down on strategy guides in general, go ahead. That's well warranted. But without a strategy guide, Majora's Mask would be a completely unbearable load of crap for most people, not because it's 'different' or 'challenging', but because the thought process behind a lot of things requires you to have done things in exactly the way the developers wanted you to, without that way being clear.

If you want a superb example of the sort of 'guided exploration' I'm talking about, see Super Metroid. It's largely accepted as one of the greatest games of all time, and it revolves around exploration. It has brilliant puzzles, and lets you truly explore the world, while at the same time positioning things in almost exactly the right way to get you going the way you need to be, without ever having a pointer saying "GO THIS DIRECTION".

I had so much fun off this game. I got all of the Masks and got the Fierce Diety.

Ocarina of Time.

I found Majora's Mask to be too busy. There's too much focus on little tasks and helping people whereas I just want a large world to explore by myself. Although I do recognise Majora's Mask to be the better game in quality.

I will be buying Majora's Mask 3D if they ever make one.

Reviving 3 year old threads is fun