Topic: The everything Xbox thread

@FragRed "What ever happens, streaming won't catch on for enough people to justify it being the main way to play games for years to come - perhaps a decade or more at least, so none of this really maters yet. Hardware will remain the number one interest in most consumers for a long time to come".

That is right. Next "generation" (to call it something) Microsoft will release a hardware console and a streaming console, so streaming will be just an option in the near future. I have no idea what will Nintendo do, probably the next thing will be a revised Switch. One thing is certain, Sony will have a much harder time next time than back in 2013 with Don Pattrick messing with the Xbox brand and niche Wii U console.

@BlueOcean I totally agree. Sony have kinda had it easy for 3 out of the 4 home consoles in terms of competition. Sega and Nintendo messed up with the Saturn & N64 which allowed Sony to get their foot in the console door and create a run away success, though Sony did also help themselves with a system designed to be third party friendly. The only system they struggled to hit the ground running with was the PS3 in part due to poor management but also because they had good competition.

@BlueOcean the controls in red dead aren't as bad as some have made it seem. While they are in no way perfect, they aren't so bad and jarring that it messes up the game.

@FragRed LOL, yeah Rockstar and good controls don't tend to go together. GTAV had ok controls....but I'm not a fan of GTA V in general. Bland game, bland gameplay, way less campaign than previous GTA games. Just kind of a big sandbox to screw around in which to me is the worst of Western game design. RDR is kind of the opposite. Gunplay is still bland as anything, but the living breathing world experience is great.

I also don't think streaming is this universal thing for a long, long, long time. The internet just isn't in good condition for that. Good option for those it works for, but Sony had the only mass market streaming service up to now and even they're backing down from it with moving to a Game Pass like model (except PS3, at least until PS5 can emulate PS3.) Xcloud will probably be better than Now, but it still feels like a more limited niche product that's kind of geographically bound.

@BlueOcean FH4: I'm starting to think you skim rather than read my text walls I mentioned the supersampling possibility when we discussed it before. But yeah, I'm glad you see what I'm talking about now and don't think I'm (that) crazy The detailed lighting and textures on things like buildings, to me, matter as well too, but yeah I think it's the fsaa/ss combination particularly on foliage that makes such a difference to me. That kind of brings back an old thread I had with someone about not understanding the push to 4k displays in gaming when games currently (previously) didn't look close to 1080p video. It seems like the sweet spot target should be 60Hz, 1080p output supersampled from 4k rendering. With a decent video scaler that could produce the most cinematic visuals until the power to render 8k and supersample to 4k is practical.

"How do you deal with Switch visuals on a TV"
Given that this is 2018 and I owned a WiiU: I play XBox. Seriously I haven't played much Switch on TV since Mario Odyssey which looked great with the art style, and I played a lot of Xenoblade 2, South Park, and some indies over the last 6 months mostly handheld on the go. The few times I put XC2 onto the TV, it feels kind of blurry (people complain about it in handheld mode, yeah the resolution drops but at 6" it's decent looking, I think it looks worse smoothed on a 1080p screen even if it has more detail. But Dark Souls and Starlink on the display are making me cringe a bit, yes. Especially Starlink. I'd have bought that on X1 were it not for Starfox being the main draw. (Great game though, even without Fox, worth playing on X1 if you don't plan on getting a Switch when you see it half price in like 4 weeks. It's simplified, a little Saturday Morning cartoon, awful story, but if you like the Assassin's Creed open worlds, it's an AC open world in a spaceship. It plays like a Ubisoft open world mixed with the fun of blasting around in Forza Horizon with a taste of Doom's frantic gunplay. It won't redefine art, it may be popcorn entertainment, but it sure is fun to play!)

RDR2: It's still a worthy game to be on the radar. The real draw in terms of "gameplay" isn't conventional. Gunfights are paint by numbers bland - it's no Bungie, EA, or Ubisoft shooter, that's for sure. But most of the game isn't shooting, it's just "existing" in the world, and the world is very alive. The control complaints do hamper the fun at times with some frustration, but it doesn't derail the game, it's just frustrating that they could spent so much time on ridiculous details and overlook important control issues. (Our buddy @Octane in the PS4 thread today pointed out the rather disturbing fact that they accurately animated the shrinkage of equine genitalia in changing temperatures.........yet failed to figure out that using the same button for "interact with person" and "draw and aim gun" wasn't a good plan. )

As a Wii U owner I also think that Switch is having a quiet second year and even had a quiet first year... But back to Xbox stuff, why didn't Rockstar include many controller setups in Red Dead Redemption 2? Something that would make controls more intuitive for everyone? This game has been in development for consoles (and not PC) for years? Haven't they realised? Most importantly, would the Xbox Accessories app solve this issues by button mapping?

@DarthNocturnal Next time I play the game, I'm going to have to fight myself to not try to see the animations. Thank you, @Octane, for ruining RDR2. Apparently Rule 34 takes no prisoners.

@NEStalgia You're welcome

@BlueOcean The really frustrating part of the controls: not unlike Dark Souls on Switch which for some reason uses XBox A and B buttons rather than Nintendo A and B, and while it has a button mapping configuration, grays out those two buttons, it actually does have numerous control setups.

Unfortunately most of them are exactly the same, swapping only 2-4 buttons. There's like 6-8 options, and you can separate which settings you use for third person and first person mode. But across all 6-8 most of the buttons remain unchanged. Several of them are "Southpaw(left handed)" varieties that basically swap the left and right sides of the controller. Most infuriatingly there's "FPS Standard." In Halo, that setup means "similar layout to CoD/BF/R6/". In RDR2 that setup means "keep everything the same, except map run to L3, and crouch to A" So, not very FPS standard....

Given the feedback I'm starting to think it's hopeful they patch in a button mapper at some point. There's too much noise around their once-a-decade quadruple-A game on the controls to leave it like that. Especially after what looks like 6M sales in a week.

There's a quote on the reddit about this that I think sums it up perfectly:
"I haven't really had much of a problem with them yet. It's a big complicated open world Rockstar game, and the controls are about what they usually are in one of those. Often confusing and poorly explained, but manages to accomplish a lot and be intuitive enough for people who have played the rest of their games."

I still feel like Rockstar is trying to effectively create a "Rockstar standard control setup" to set themselves apart and be different.

For XBox, yeah, you could use the accessories app and remap it, and that would help with shooting and such. But the problem with that is because the game has so many "unique button to use in this one particular situation" moments when they prompt you for pseudo-QTEs and prompts, you'd have to map in your head where you really mapped that button every time. That might make it worse.

It also wouldn't solve "use two different buttons with two different press lengths to pick up two objects on the ground next to each other, because one is a gun and one is clothing" type oddities, nor the " the hanging man and the deputy are cats because targeting sees the cat through the wooden platform and neither the hanging man nor deputy can be interacted with at this moment" scenario. And there's no real solution, even in patches for "interact/aim gun" being the same button applied contextually. Even remapping can't save that. The idea may have been cool, but it depends on the game always understanding your intent.

I was playing Nier Automata a little yesterday and was amazed. Even a Square-Enix/Platinum ARPG game managed to have full button mapping, and Rockstar's opus shoehorns the weirdest controls in without choice.

It still doesn't change that it's a fantastic game world and great experience, and you certainly can and do come to terms (at least mostly) with the controls enough to enjoy the game, but I'll never quite stop fighting against the controls often enough to be reminded they're weird.

Edit: It just occurred to me, I bet the weird targeting system was integrated in the game for future VR compatibility. Then you really do just "push button to interact" and look physically at the person or object to interact with. The system is perfect if you're intentionally building VR systems into a game. Unfortunately it's kind of awful with a controller.

That works out for me. Been somewhat interested in BF1 due to its WW1 setting even though FPSs are not my top fav thing, but not having to pay a penny for any of it checks out fine.

Also all the Castlevania Lords of Shadow games and Just Cause 1 are now Backwards Compat.

@DarthNocturnal Always a downer when the list is great and you realize you've already bought it all It's ok, I just love AC1 so I don't regret rebuying. And BF1 I got on the cheap E3 sale bundled with Andromeda or Titanfall 2, so it was peanuts.

I've only barely played the BF1 campaign but the tank was fun

@DarthNocturnal You don't, I got the Premium the day it was made free as well as other DLC for games I don't own if they're free or on really good offer, in-case I pick the game up either very cheaply, or in this case for free.

My only problem is my HDD has barely any space left and BF1 is a meaty download.... lol.

Just noticed the pass is also free on the PSN Store. Even if I don't own the system, I snapped that up too. XD

Errr what? It had one of the most insane first years for any console ever!

@NEStalgia Well, concerning RDR2, I read somewhere, that eventually, like after a half hour of play, you will most likely get used to those misplaced buttons. And if not, there should at least be an option to adjust/change controls? If that isn't there, then I guess it's indeed just a case of having to get used to it.

And after all, there's plenty more games with weird, clunky or illogical controls, and there will probably always will be, but in the end, if we really want to play these games, we take the good with the bad, and get accustomed to them.

Fair point on Phil Spencer, but he's miles better than Reggie, so I'd still feel more secure betting on him than on mr. Nintendo Marketing...

P.S.

Will you please stop mentioning me in regards to "hating" performance mode on FH4? Joke or not (and if it is,
I don't think it's funny), I never said anything even remotely close to that. You yourself started this whole exchange of text walls between you, me and @BlueOcean, by mentioning your own indecisiveness about whether or not to choose one mode over the other.

In response, I just said I found it rather useless to drive up close to trees and shrubs to look at the texture detail (which it is), and that performance mode, now that it's available, might be the better choice for a racing game (well, at least: for most people anyway), seeing as that what it's ultimately about, even though it is a racing game that allows you to literally drive just about anywhere.

Just exploring is nice, but other than perhaps unintentionally stumbling upon barn finds and billboard locations, it isn't going to win you any prices, events or races, so you had better concentrate on doing that, then on how many polygons were used to make up the individual leaves of the nearest oak tree...

@DarkRula Aha. Well, that will be quite the achievement then, if he manages it. I don't know how far you can tweak these useless vehicles, to at least make it somewhat possible to use them in races and so on, but personally, I would probably never select any of these vehicles, unless I win them, but then I'd just put them away in the garage, or I would occasionally try some of them, when I don't want to do a serious race.

Some might even be hilariously funny to do jumping challenges with...

@BlueOcean Perhaps you should simply check those lists on those links I posted, and cross-check which cars you have, and which you haven't. The lists should also mention where exactly to find those cars/barns.

As for the part where I mentioned the map and the voice controlled route planner: you need to be in the vicinity of a barn find first, before the route planner will tell you that she can set you on a course towards the nearest barn find. Just drive around, and activate the route planner from time to time, and you'll see.

And once the route is set, the full screen map will also display this challenge, and you can plan the shortest route to it from there. On that map, you should see a translucent purple, circular area, with a barn icon inside of it, like this:

If I remember correctly, undetected barn find icons/logos should also be visible on the map as a greyed out logo. Once they're detected, they change to the familiar purple circular area that contains the barn and the challenge tied to it, as you will know.

@FragRed Congrats on your purchase. Like others have already said to you, the X has far more advantages than just 4K, so rest assured that you can just let your current TV serve its purpose for however many more years it will last, before you make the jump to 4K, and see the X in its full glory, but until then, upscaling, super sampling, HDR, faster loading times and better performance are already a HUGE gain compared to any other console on the market right now.

@Dezzy It's most likely the ports debate, that if you don't rebuy stuff you already own on other consoles and have Wii U + PS4/XB1 that Switch's lineup has been rather quiet.

It's exactly that.

@ThanosReXXX I found them all. Two of them were in Hot Wheels and Blizzard Mountain and the other two were triggered by Forzathon challenges that you can complete anywhere. Progress is not well explained because it's more a discovery game I guess but I think that I have them all now. Now I am playing both FH3 and FH4 because I love 4 but I still have stuff to do in 3 and I still enjoy my time with it, especially now that instead of asking Anna repetitive stuff to do that I can't complete I browse the map and decide what is my next challenge as you suggested. What is that "Horizon Promo Cars Captures" thing? I have zero. Is it to take photographs of cars or what?

Both Assassin's Creed (which I loved) and Battlefield 1 are X-enhanced. I got the Premium Battle Pass free just now. The official description: "Conquer the entire Great War with Battlefield™ 1 Premium Pass including new multiplayer maps, unlockable weapons, new armies, new vehicles and more in four themed digital expansion packs".

@BlueOcean Perhaps a good suggestion for "what to do next?" is trying to scour the map and the world, and see if you can find all the billboards. That'll keep you busy a bit longer than the barn finds, amount-wise...

As for the "Horizon Promo Cars Captures" thing, this might help explain things:
https://www.trueachievements.com/a223073/forzatographer-achie...
And yes, it's about taking photos of cars. The more, the better, and also look for rare cars.

@Grumblevolcano

Hmmmm well Mario Odyssey, Xenoblade 2, Splatoon 2, ARMS, Mario +Rabbids, are all exclusive.

That alone is a good first year. Then when you add the fact that Mario Kart has battle tracks added and Zelda has better framerate and resolution, I think it's a pretty good first year.

@ThanosReXXX Yeah, P50, Beetle, Reliant - they're novelty vehicles. Good for a few fun races against the same kind of vehicle, but otherwise only good for a collector's item. Far be it from me to tell people what to do during Forzathon Live events when I've used the Lambo Cento to tackle drift zones on dirt roads.
And a Mini Cooper on one memorable time.

I just took a photo of three cars and the Horizon Promo Cars Captures is still 0. I must be doing something wrong.