@hatty.... Sonys press conference can be found here, and they had a ton of games a the conference and the Move showing was extremely impressive. Nintendo ran with this one, but Sony was right there with them. Well worth watching.
3D is not a viable present. Very few gamers have 3D TVs. The cheapest 3D TV at bestbuy.com is $1800, with 3D glasses at $150, of which I'm sure you'd want several. Unless you live in a house made of money, you cannot ignore that cost. The online is here now, and we are already able to use it -- most PS3s are already connected and making use of this. I think you have present and future mixed up.
I'm not sure you quite understand what future and present mean in business terms. Present is the next 12 months. 3D over the next 12 months will be more mainstream- there's already plenty of reports out there that large numbers of people are considering 3D purchases.
When I talk about online, I'm talking about the point, a couple of years from now, where digital download delivery is the dominant market - it's what EA, Square Enix, Sony, Microsoft, Ubisoft and Zygna are either setting up for, or prepared for. The future of online is not just having consoles hooked up to the internet. That's the industry's first tentative steps into the internet. Building up a proper online practice takes time and money, however - and funnily enough, Nintendo's the only one not doing it.
When was the last time Nintendo made the acquisition of an online-only developer or publisher (Like EA did)? When was the last time Nintendo invested in building a digital-only device, accessory, or business unit (like Sony, Ubisoft, Square Enix has)? Nintendo has left it's strategy firmly rooted in the belief that the industry will look the same in five years as it looks now, which won't happen.
This is the cartridge thing all over again. For such an innovative company, Nintendo has proven remarkably stubbon in actually moving with market forces with some things. Smart businesses make investments and prepare for trends that are as far as 10 years away. I'm not always convinced that Nintendo is a smart business (of course, at other times, such as the Wii and with touch screens, Nintendo has proven it can read the market very well - I don't understand why it hates digital media so much)
I think the answer's already been provided above, Waltz. The Wii is simply not capable of a hearty online experience. As someone else put it better than I could, it's not a fix that requires a bandaid...it requires a heart transplant.
i.e.: a new console. Which Nintendo isn't ready to introduce yet. (And judging from the continued flood of robust first-party titles, they probably won't be for a while.)
It's foolish to suggest that Nintendo doesn't care about missing out on the downloadable market. Of course they care; that's another place to make money. But since they can't do it with their current console's resources, the best thing for them to do is focus attention elsewhere. Why draw attention to the Wii's greatest drawback at such a massive media event?
One thing we know about Nintendo is that they very rarely announce anything until it's ready to go tomorrow afternoon. They probably have all kinds of plans for their next console, and may even be working on the tech for it. I wouldn't doubt it for a second. And that new console is probably going to offer a much better online experience. In fact, I'd be shocked if it didn't.
But either way, it's foolish to assume that because they didn't make a big stink about downloadable content that they aren't interested in it at all, and will continue to stay disinterested for another 10 years while the industry rushes on ahead and Miyamoto is reduced to peddling video game concepts for food.
The Wii can't offer a strong online experience. The Wii is their current console. Hence, the reason they didn't spend all their Wii time talking about how awesome a strong online experience would be.
Ah, I understand then, though I must say I'm doubtful. People expected Bluray to take off, but really, while it is gaining popularity, it is not doing so at a very fast pace like the DVD did, though maybe I just remember time passing quicker when I was younger.
3D TVs are prohibitively expensive. $1800 is not going to fall down that much in a mere 12 months, and there's still the matter of expensive glasses, of which you'll likely want a few.
And this is a company that is also trying to get its customers to buy expensive peripherals for Wii Sports rip-offs. Until costs come down significantly, there will be no shortage of people "considering" the 3D TV, but very few actually taking the dive, and today isn't exactly the greatest time to be wasting money. I don't see this happening.
Either way, "predictions" are by definition the stuff of the future, so I don't see how 3D is the present no matter what stars may have aligned and no matter how many fingers their employees may cross. Until we know that install base is there, that's some funny definition of present.
3D is not a viable present. Very few gamers have 3D TVs. The cheapest 3D TV at bestbuy.com is $1800, with 3D glasses at $150, of which I'm sure you'd want several. Unless you live in a house made of money, you cannot ignore that cost. The online is here now, and we are already able to use it -- most PS3s are already connected and making use of this. I think you have present and future mixed up.
People said the exact same thing when HDTVs came out. Nintendo actually won BECAUSE they were able to make their console cheaper. Given what people are generally willing to pay for new consoles historically (Generally consoles that start over $300 fail), the PS3 and Xbox 360 should have released this past year. They were overpowered then. BUT, they're both obviously in it for the longer haul (esp. PS3, don't know about the Xbox's 3D capabilities - they haven't said anything so I assume it's not 3D capable for whatever reason), and they won't have to be replaced. In a year or two, the TVs will be down to $1000, and then some people will start buying them to watch their pretty 3D blurays. Then you'll get enough saturation for some TV networks to start offering shows in 3D. The regular channels will be HD and the HD channels will be 3D (with HD it's already happening/happened). Then more people will buy them, and it will just spiral in on itself.
CES showed that 3DTVs was the future the industry hoped to move in and not just Sony. 3D will happen; it won't be too expensive forever. Even Nintendo's now admitted they'll need to make the Wii2 3D capable. 5 years down the line, there will be a fair amount of people who will be looking to replace their HDTVs. You'll have to buy a new Wii, or you can just keep your Playstation. Or, you can have both, but then saving money on consoles probably doesn't matter all that much to you anyways. Sony will win business wise, because they'll be able to sell their console over two generations, not just one.
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I'm extremely skeptical about the future market penetration of 3D, even if a few people come on board just to be able to show off their home theater setup. It's not really analogous to any of the recent changes. From CRT to flat-panel, the transition was also pushed before the tech had matured, but at least there were compelling reasons for the consumer: much more attractive form factor for your living room even when the screen size itself gets very large, lower energy consumption, etc. More importantly, the TV was all you needed and a whole room full of people could enjoy watching it; this nonsense about ridiculously expensive glasses for every participant is absolutely horrible.
I don't even think that any particular strides in technology are behind the push for home 3D; it's really all about trying to create more demand, after the wave of new TV purchases due to HD fell off a bit. Admittedly, my sentiments against it are just as much personal distaste and they are any kind of business analysis, but I just don't find the current tech to be worthwhile.
On a handheld, with no glasses needed, for a single viewer holding the device a small distance away? Sure. For home setups where the TV may be relatively far from the couch, so that the feeling of depth is already reduced, and only for a very small amount of content (say what you will, very few serious films outside of the action-blockbuster type or CG are likely to use this anytime in the next decade), with an additional device and cost for each viewer? It just seems like a terrible idea to me. I also deeply oppose its overuse in film for aesthetic reasons, but that's another debate.
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I fail to see how Sony "wins," Token Girl. Nintendo isn't losing anything. They're the only company to consistently profit on their actual hardware, and they have the most successful first-party software. Nintendo is in a win-win situation, and they've just shown they have actual content to back this up, unlike Move and K'nex or whatever. They have a 3D machine that everyone in the industry is raving about, and even their competitors are praising. Sony has a 3D machine two or three people can use (and Bill Gates isn't going to buy it, so really, make that one or two), and Microsoft assures us 3D is coming someday.
Consider how much people spent on a Wii. $200 or $250. This also netted them a game or two and maybe a Motion Plus. If Nintendo stays true to their vision with their next console and continues to make affordable products with software fans are not willing to pass on, there's a good chance that when we eventually do have a Wii 2 to buy, you may well be able to add the cost of that to your first Wii and still have spent less than early adopters of a PS3, and if you include the extra hardware Sony and Microsoft are pushing now, the costs will definitely be in Nintendo's favor.
Regardless, your "5 year" strategy does not at all contradict what I said: 3D is not a viable present. Yes, five years down the road it'll be as important as HD supposedly is today... and oh, what's that? Wii isn't HD and is still beating down the combined competition singlehandedly, not to mention how successful the DS is. So maybe Nintendo knows what it's doing after all.
Just thrown my fifty cents in here real quick.....
3D has a major flaw. Many people have severe issues to it. Especially this new digital 3D. Yeah there are people who have issues with HDTV, but the numbers increase significantly when you move into 3D because of the depth of image not actually being real causing the eye to strain to find a balance in view. Its also been studied and shown that 3D is also very bad on the eyes as well as the continued eye strain over long periods of time is just flat out not good on your eyes. Going to a two hour movie in 3D is usually walking out with a borderline migraine for me unless its the full digital 3D nonstop in the case of Avatar wich put me in the bed, throwing up and severe migraine that lasted two days. I am one of the many people with this issue to 3D. I dont have motion sickness or any of that, its just the continued eye strain that bothers the heck out of me.
Then there are the glasses. I wear contacts on the weekends as my job in construction wont allow me to wear contacts as welding and burning you eyes on accident can lead to a major problem if I melts you contacts to you eyes, so Im in glasses 5 days a week. Im also coming home with grease, rust, dirt and god knows what else in my hands, nails everyday. Do you think I, or anyone else who works like me for a living, will come home from work and drop my contacts in to put on 3D glasses to watch TV. I would like to think NOT!
3D is work. Its not relaxing. Come home flip it on and kick back and relax. Its work, wearing glasses, putting in contacts, and eyestrain with prevents relaxing. Think of this, when is the last time you went to a 3D movie and felt relaxed? Im betting you havent.
3DS sounds like a great alternative to this, but its not possible for a TV as the dual screens create the illusion. Im willing to bet that 3DS will be a lot easier on the eyes, etc and Im really looking forward to getting one in my hands, but as for Sony and all this 3D Home Theatre buisness. I dont see it myself. Im a big electronic guy. Heck just my gameroom has 2 HDTVs, 2 PS3, 2 Wiis and full amplified surround sound and powered bass support, and that is just my play room. Im one of the prime targets for this type of thing and I have no interest in spending the money on it at all.
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I've actually not been able to see a single 3D movie yet, believe it or not, so thanks for the warning. I'm prone to migraines myself just from staring at normal screens too long, so I'll make sure if I do see a movie in 3D ever that it's a great one, haha.
It was the most boring thing I ever sat through. They didn't announce any new games, except maybe that stupid Sorcerer thing, and they almost the entire presentation praising themselves and showing videos of samey sequels to series I already didn't care about to begin with. And where was The Last Guardian? Seriously? They had nothing on that the entire presentation. I haven't been this disappointed since the Nintendo Conference at E3 '08!
I was about to say that Ueda is a perfectionist and it probably won't be done for awhile... but then I saw Wikipedia listed it as a 2010 release and its source checked out! Weird. I mean, a delay is not that shocking, but they could have said something either way after saying it'd be out this year, at least according to 1UP.
Just thrown my fifty cents in here real quick.....
3D has a major flaw. Many people have severe issues to it. Especially this new digital 3D. Yeah there are people who have issues with HDTV, but the numbers increase significantly when you move into 3D because of the depth of image not actually being real causing the eye to strain to find a balance in view. Its also been studied and shown that 3D is also very bad on the eyes as well as the continued eye strain over long periods of time is just flat out not good on your eyes. Going to a two hour movie in 3D is usually walking out with a borderline migraine for me unless its the full digital 3D nonstop in the case of Avatar wich put me in the bed, throwing up and severe migraine that lasted two days. I am one of the many people with this issue to 3D. I dont have motion sickness or any of that, its just the continued eye strain that bothers the heck out of me.
Then there are the glasses. I wear contacts on the weekends as my job in construction wont allow me to wear contacts as welding and burning you eyes on accident can lead to a major problem if I melts you contacts to you eyes, so Im in glasses 5 days a week. Im also coming home with grease, rust, dirt and god knows what else in my hands, nails everyday. Do you think I, or anyone else who works like me for a living, will come home from work and drop my contacts in to put on 3D glasses to watch TV. I would like to think NOT!
3D is work. Its not relaxing. Come home flip it on and kick back and relax. Its work, wearing glasses, putting in contacts, and eyestrain with prevents relaxing. Think of this, when is the last time you went to a 3D movie and felt relaxed? Im betting you havent.
3DS sounds like a great alternative to this, but its not possible for a TV as the dual screens create the illusion. Im willing to bet that 3DS will be a lot easier on the eyes, etc and Im really looking forward to getting one in my hands, but as for Sony and all this 3D Home Theatre buisness. I dont see it myself. Im a big electronic guy. Heck just my gameroom has 2 HDTVs, 2 PS3, 2 Wiis and full amplified surround sound and powered bass support, and that is just my play room. Im one of the prime targets for this type of thing and I have no interest in spending the money on it at all.
Mind you, they said all of this about colour TV and Movies when technicolor came into existance, and studies at the time also "prooved" you could go blind watching technicolour movies.
Regardless, your "5 year" strategy does not at all contradict what I said: 3D is not a viable present. Yes, five years down the road it'll be as important as HD supposedly is today... and oh, what's that? Wii isn't HD and is still beating down the combined competition singlehandedly, not to mention how successful the DS is. So maybe Nintendo knows what it's doing after all.
You know, there was a little company called "TSR" once, that became one of the biggest entertainment companies in the world riding on the back of the Dungeons and Dragons popularity wave.
But TSR had a problem - it didn't properly predict where the market would be in 5, 10 years, and would have gone out of business if Wizards of the Coast didn't buy it, and subsequently save it, by properly modernising it.
Nintendo has proven that its long-term strategies are hit and miss at best, and its stubbon resistance to some industry trends have cost it dearly - CD/ DVD technology (N64 and Gamecube proprietry formats cost Nintendo dearly), and then a slowness to adopt online technology has left the Wii and DSi lagging behind the PS3 and Xbox 360 in that field.
I love Nintendo, but their long term strategies are a concern.
So one company that isn't remotely connected to Nintendo almost goes out of business supposedly for not moving with the times, and that's a sign? People said the DS would flop and the Wii would fail because it was not moving with the times.
The present comes first, the future later. Nintendo walked in with guns blazing while their competition showed off expensive tech with imitation software and little else to back it up. Sony and Microsoft's short-term strategies are a concern, and you don't make it to a long-term strategy without first going through a short-term.
People bought a Wii for Wii Sports. They aren't going to now buy a PS3 to play PS3 Sports or a 360 to play K'nex sports, especially when they'll then have to buy even more expensive equipment on top of that to play a game they already have. And then if they want it in 3D they'll have to sell their house, which may lead to other problems.
As for "lagging behind" in online... so what? The competition is lagging behind in original ideas, with cookie cutter sequel after cookie cutter sequel and bad imitation software supporting imitation hardware. Nintendo has already said that, like 3D, online will be a focus in the future. The Wii was a last ditch effort to keep them afloat, and it succeeded well beyond anyone's expectations, probably Nintendo's included. They were not in a position to do anything else -- nothing to do with lack of foresight.
I have nothing more to add than this: Samsung, Mitsubishi, Phillips and others are already working on (or in some cases have already demo'd) 3d televisions that do NOT require the use of special 3d glasses.
I doubt they are ready for mass sale and I suspect they will be even more expensive than "standard" 3D tv's, but the technology seems as if it will be available at some point in the next one to four years.
Samsung, Mitsubishi, Phillips and others are already working on (or in some cases have already demo'd) 3d televisions that do NOT require the use of special 3d glasses.
I seriously had no idea about this one, though my care for 3D is a bare minimum at best.
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Well since ill either be praised or argued against anyways, I'll just say my opinion that sony won for me and i need not explain why to anyone else with their own opinion
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I'm guessing that most future 3rd party Wii games using motion control will come out on PS3 as well with HD graphics using Move. Perhaps Epic Mickey will be one of the first...
Well since ill either be praised or argued against anyways, I'll just say my opinion that sony won for me and i need not explain why to anyone else with their own opinion
No crap from me man. I actually think Sony had a great showing at E3. They did show tons more games than just what was presented onstage. Not to mention the recreation of their E3 booth online in Playstation Home was a cool addition as well.
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Two things: (1) Thanks to everyone for the good conversation. Whether we agree or not, a lot of people brought up a lot of good points and it was an interesting read. (2) I understand how some people feel Sony won. If they shortened the presentation and were more selective with what they talked about, I might even agree -- looking back, they definitely had a lot of great announcements. Nothing wrong with having different opinions here either.
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Topic: Sony E3 Press Conference: Impressions and Ratings?
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