Topic: Convincing my parents that i can branch out of nintendo - help!

Yes i love brawl, galaxy, corruption, and twilight princess, and medal of honor 2, they are very fun for wii. However im open to his suggestions

EDIT By the way, ive just set my desktop background to a ps3 slim and its controller lol in hopes that my parents will be like what is this? and then i can explain. Really contemplating the stupidity of doing this against the hope that it works lol

I wouldn't get rid of a system for another. If you get your own money, can't you buy it?

nope, im allowed to buy new wii games, but apparently thats way different than buying a new system entirely, strange rule, but hopefully in time i can work around it and if not, i guess its not meant to be lol

Words of wisdom from this man right here.

Machu, I don't understand. How can you say that kids should be out there making their own mistakes (and learning from them), yet advocate absolute obedience to parents? If kids always obey their parents, then they will not have sufficient freedom with which to make mistakes. And when these children who have only learned how to obey do inevitably get that freedom later in life, they tend to screw up big time because of a lack of experience in dealing with it.

I'm really surprised how many people are giving the Obey Thy Parents advice. Why? Why should parents dictate to their child how to spend his own money? Is it because the parents pay for food and shelter and take care of him? Well if that's the case, then should stay-at-home moms have to obey their husbands - morally bound to let their husbands dictate to them how they can use their own money? And should roommates have to obey each other 50% of the time? Should elderly parents who move in with their children have to obey their children, since their children look after them and pay the bills?

Well, you might say, forget all that - the actual reason some people have to obey those who pay for the food & house they live in while others don't is because they're the children of the people who are paying for that stuff. So if a 25-year-old person lives with his mother, does he still have to only spend his money how his mother sees fit?

Well, you might say, forget all that - the actual reason why some children have to obey their parents while others don't is because they're below a certain age. How do you decide that age, and on what grounds? Any grounds you present for that age limit are going to be sweeping generalisations. If you say 18 is the limit and "maturity" is the grounds for it, and I present to you a very mature 15 year old, what grounds have you for saying that the 15 year old shouldn't be allowed to decide how to spend their own money? The arbitrary rule you made up, when the very justification for that rule was immaturity and so that doesn't apply at all to this specific case?! In other words, no general age-limit rule can be established.

DaDun, to add to the excellent advice already given by Thomas Joseph and Stuffgamer, assure your parents that you won't be spending any more time playing than you already do and that you'll keep your grades up. You don't want to play more - you only want to be able to play certain games that don't work on the Wii.

@clicketyclick: How right you are regarding arbitrary rulings, especially the ones said to be based on "maturity." Some people twice my age are only half as mature as I am (and I'm 20), while some are younger than I and more mature (like my 19-year-old friend). So...short agreeing rant to mean "well said!"

Clickety, I'm afraid that your post is one long, unintentional demonstration of a logical fallacy. You are turning the argument to obey one's parents into a straw man by forcing an unfounded and logically unsound constraint, ie. that any rule or judgment must be based on a single, clearly demarcated criterion. That's far from the case in all matters of complexity or importance, and obeying your parents is a prime example.

It's not just a matter of living with and depending on your parents, it's a combination of factors, including their raising you from birth--certainly not something that can be done without immense time and resource commitment that a young person can't even fathom--and the fact that maturity is indeed a process rather than a sudden awakening. Sure, no precise age marker can be found if you look only at maturity, but the fact remains that the child itself is in no way the one who can reliably make the reflective judgment as to whether he or she is mature enough to make decision X on his own. It's a matter or respect for those who have led you up to this point to continue to generally obey their rules while you're still in high school, even though you'll naturally argue with them, which is part of the process of slowly achieving the maturity to handle it yourself. Yes, there are cases where the parents may be misleading you or may in fact not be upholding their parental duties, so even the rule to generally obey and respect them has bounds, but as a general rule of thumb, unless you're willing to make the case that your parents are failing fundamentally in their capacity of raising you, it's reasonable and a matter of respect for you to generally obey them while you're still in high school and living with them, or to make your case respectfully with them in discussion or argument if you believe their decision is wrong; which I believe DaDun has been doing, and which is perfectly fine.

@clicketyclick: Do you really think I told the whole story there?!? I was painting a picture, for the sake of a 16yr old lad, who should be listening to his parents and concentrating on his studies, NOT worrying about ****ing games and consoles, which WILL only detract from his development. I'm not sure why you felt the need to disagree when all I was trying to do was shepherd someone in the right direction, do a good deed if you will.

severe edit, having calmed down

Tbh, I'm beyond caring now, maybe falling out with his parents over a console is worth it to you. I was just trying to do the right thing, sorry if you disagree with what were, good intentions.

It's true that no individual is capable of pinpointing exactly when they are mature. It's also true that their parents aren't either, since parents are too influenced by emotions and nostalgia, and desires that their children follow in their footsteps. The only proper judge of maturity is experience. How do you gain maturity without experience? If a person only obeys, they will never mature to be able to think for themselves. People think that "with freedom comes great responsibility" means that responsibility is some sort of counterweight to freedom - a downside to it. But actually, it's freedom that teaches responsibility; the freer you are, the more you become aware of competing moral and practical issues and the more they influence your decisions. So naturally, if you become free, you're likely also going to become much more responsible.

@Machu - You seem to be ignoring the particulars of his situation, since you continue to insist that he should be out with his friends and concentrating on school rather than isolated and alone, despite the fact that DaDun already explained that this isn't the case with him (he has tons of friends and excellent grades and plays a bunch of different sports.) I get the sense from your emotional reply that you're not trying to give advice to DaDun, but to your younger self. That's not exactly fair to DaDun here, since he's not you. Buying a PS3 is not tantamount to running away from home, after all.

To DaDun... People often think Abraham is the perfect example of how you should Obey Thy Father, since he was even ready to sacrifice his son because God ordered him to. People forget though that it was Abraham who contradicted, argued and reasoned with God when he felt His decision was unjust rather than obeying like everyone else (Gen. 18:22-33). And it was Abraham, unlike everyone else, who was made the leader of the nation by God. There is a way to disagree with your father respectfully, and you should when the rules are unjust.

I think you are very mature DaDun. I would suggest that you've answered your own questions with your self awareness.

@Cowlaunch thanks man
@Clicketyandmachu you both have good points, i think clickety is right that without any risk you won't gain anything, and without trying something first you will never learn any life lessons, but then again machus right in the sense that my parents did raise me and i should respect them despite what i think sometimes. A possible solution as clickety said is to maintain my performance in school and sports and all that so my parents can see how a ps3 wouldn't detract from my performance and then give me a shot at owning one, and well, if they still say no, i guess ill have to accept it as machu says. I think time really will tell, it could go either way and either/both of you would be right in a sense, just like a lot of other people here who gave sound advice too.

Clix, freedom may teach responsibility, but not everyone's ready to learn it. I know you're not saying we should just let everyone at every age do and get what they please, but still, the point must be made. Also, I winced at your psych eval of Machu saying he was giving advice to his younger self. Even if he were, then a.) there's a value experience which he was considerate enough to share, and b.) it was a poorly concealed dig on your part. You're above that as the Sun is above the Moon, darling.

DaDun, here's what you do ('cause I'm the final authority here, right? Yeah, sure...) Take the money to your folks and say "look, here's the money. Help me open an online trading account and pick a few penny stocks in which to invest. I'll do some research and tool around with the account for a half hour per day and see if I can stay above water or even make a few bucks. You get me the PS3, I'll keep my grades up, and stay social, and even pick up some skills about investing along the way."
If you've got the money to burn on a second game console, then bro, I say play one where you can make a little in return!

Do not fear clicketyclick I had that conversation with myself over ten years ago. I wasn't being emotional either, you over-estimate me, I was just trying to point the guy in the 'right' direction. And I questioned why anyone would disagree with such sentiments. Still do.

Do what you want DaDun. I did. It was frakkin' sweet! And there wasn't a console in sight, apart from a SNES that got whipped out when we were REALLY REALLY bored.

Vendetta, he heavily edited his reply. You didn't read it before it was edited, I bet. It was much more extensive and personal.

EDIT: and machu, I said you were being emotional because of your overreaction to what I said. Clearly you agree that you were being emotional, since your edit says that you removed things now that you've "calmed down".

No, more like it contained content I perhaps shouldn't display here. But glad you enjoyed it.

And you probably posted what you now think you shouldn't have because you got carried away with your emotions, eh? I noticed you also edited out your abbreviated swearing at me.

Anyway, no hard feelings, Machu. You're a great guy and I guess you've been through a lot I can't even begin to imagine, but, er, your experiences are, I think, a little weightier than buying a PS3, ja?

She won't give up till I'm on my knees with tears in my eyes. Trouble, I tell's ya.

Seriously, it's not about the PS3, it's about doing as his parents request and not forcing the point. After all, if they have decided it's not gonna happen, then they will just say no out of principle now.
But yeah, it's not the first time I've got a lil carried away on here (and gone off on a tangent), the real me is sprinkled randomly throughout these forums, the bits I haven't deleted anyway.

EDIT: Whilst CC sounds like someone I'd like to argue with in real life, all this typing is a bit much. I concede!

I agree - I'd never advocate forcing the point. However, questioning your parents' rules and presenting your POV in a calm, reasoned, and respectful way will not result in a massive falling out with your parents.

If their issue with him buying a PS3 is because they think that the Wii and PS3 play the same games, explaining it to them may get them to reconsider. If their issue is that they fear his grades will drop, his promise to keep his grades up may get them to reconsider. And if their issue is instead with thinking he's not mature enough to decide this, then presenting his perspective in a calm and reasoned manner may demonstrate to them that he is mature enough.

There's nothing to lose from trying to present your side of things to your parents, and if someone wants to be treated like an adult, then they should act like one by respectfully disagreeing and presenting a reasoned argument rather than throwing tantrums or sulking (or just dutifully obeying like an opinion-less child.)

I wonnnnnnder at whom that tongue is pointing. No good deed will go unpunished today, Machu! LOL You're incorrigible, Clix.

Strofan, your last sentence is a good perspective. In time, there will be many opportunities to do your own thing without needing parental approval. And eventually, sadly, it won't be an option for many. So get while the gettin's good.

Whatever happend to doing what you want to do regardless of what people say? You get one life,use it up for what it's worth.No one deserves that ps3 more than you do I say wait till your 17 that way your parents can't tell you squat.