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Topic: Are we seeing the end of a traditional generational console release system?

Posts 21 to 31 of 31

Grumblevolcano

@Peek-a-boo: I could see it, when companies are so far ahead of their competitors they tend to abuse their power. For example, Nintendo got way too cocky because of the Wii and DS major success that they set themselves up for failure with Wii U and 3DS (they turned the 3DS around by massive price drop but not the Wii U). The same thing happened with Sony and Microsoft regarding PS2 -> PS3 and Xbox 360 -> Xbox One respectively.

What's interesting is how each company is dealing with their "failed" system. With the PS3 and this also applies to Microsoft with the Xbox One, the companies focused on the fans. For the XB1 without the fans backwards compatibility wouldn't have existed, the fantastic sales (sales as in discounts, not as in copies sold) on games wouldn't have happened, the monthly system updates which add special features which have been requested a lot wouldn't have happened, Halo 5 wouldn't have the return of Firefight (a popular co-op mode from Halo Reach and Halo 3 ODST), etc. Sony did things to please the fans during the PS3 era too.

Meanwhile, Nintendo pretty much does the opposite. No cross-buy between Wii U and 3DS VC, Paper Mario Color Splash being very Sticker Star based, Mario Tennis Ultra Smash being very barebones, Amiibo Festival instead of an actual Animal Crossing game, Hyrule Warriors missing out on key content because of a 3DS port (Linkle's story, Wind Waker story, 2 Wind Waker stages, 5 Adventure maps), etc.

Edited on by Grumblevolcano

Grumblevolcano

Switch Friend Code: SW-2595-6790-2897 | 3DS Friend Code: 3926-6300-7087 | Nintendo Network ID: GrumbleVolcano

MrGawain

@Peek-a-boo: If Microsoft announces a more powerful XB1 (which they may have to do to compete), the PS4 could look a bit old hat. It seems whatever one of the HD twins does, the other one is going to follow. It's amazing how shallow/how shallow Sony and Microsoft think their customers are about 'power'. If you just look how people have discounted the Wii U for being a weaker system.

Admittedly this could very easily turn a lot of people off of console gaming. The appeal of the generation system is you pay for a console and don't have to worry about it becoming outdated for the next 5 to 7 years. Because if you're going to buy a PS4 you have to update every 18 months, then why not just move onto PC gaming?

Isn't it obvious that Falco Lombardi is actually a parrot?

Shinion

@Grumblevolcano: I'm sure if I could be bothered I could list just as many, if not more, examples of Sony & Microsoft being 'anti-fans' in the last two gens if we're just focusing on the negatives. Borderline mandatory online subscriptions, online passes, 3rd party DLC deals or 3rd party exclusive deals (SFV/ROTTR), microtransactions in most of their games etc, and that's not even going into specifics about certain individual games like you've done, as if you look at user reviews on Metacritic most of Sony & Microsoft's first party games have disappointed a huge number of people.

Don't know what conclusions you were trying to draw with your argument because it was very one-sided and ignoring key facts.

Shinion

GrailUK

Upgrading is nothing new really (unless you are under 16 years old). However, it never bodes well for the console that does upgrade as you have half of your user base playing an inferior version of the same game that the other half are playing. Console consumers like to know what they are getting and the moment the retail guy is saying "there are two versions..." you lose your audience. It's very messy and I cannot think for a moment that a company in this day and age would even entertain the idea (unless they are hiring 16 year olds who don't know any better.)

I never drive faster than I can see. Besides, it's all in the reflexes.

Switch FC: SW-0287-5760-4611

Grumblevolcano

@TheLastLugia: Online subscriptions being a negative is arguable, online passes was 3rd party only and didn't come to Wii because those games either didn't exist on Wii or had no online in the Wii version. 3rd party DLC deals are bad but 3rd party exclusive deals also exist on Nintendo platforms (e.g. Bayonetta 2, Devil's Third), microtransactions in most of their games is a major overstatement sure there's some but there's also Nintendo games like Nintendo Badge Arcade and Miitomo.

Don't really have anything to say about Metacritic as well reviews are reviews but I'm not a fan of the scoring system in general. The way GameXplain does reviews I feel is the best way as a score doesn't really mean anything whereas an emotion like loved, liked a lot, meh, etc. does.

I feel that the past year has brought out a really dark side of Nintendo, ever since E3 it's always felt like abandonment for Wii U owners whereas Microsoft doesn't seem to be abandoning XB1 anytime soon. Even if there is an incremental upgrade console planned for the near future it sounds more like 3DS -> New 3DS more than like PS3 -> PS4.

Grumblevolcano

Switch Friend Code: SW-2595-6790-2897 | 3DS Friend Code: 3926-6300-7087 | Nintendo Network ID: GrumbleVolcano

Shinion

@Grumblevolcano:
1. Nope free online is better to me than paid online, good for you if you enjoy paying, the 'free' games they give as part of this subscription are usually crap old games.
2. Nope, The Last of Us had an online pass, so again nope.
3. Nope, the deals with SFV and ROTTR are in no way comparable to Bayonetta 2, as Bayonetta 2 was pitched to both Microsoft and Sony before Nintendo eventually paid for it, and we would never have got it if it wasn't for that. Sony paid for SFV's exclusivity as did Microsoft for ROTTR for a year, two games in iconic franchises that would have had little trouble justifying themselves and selling gangbusters if they were just released like normal games without this BS unlinke the way more 'niche' Bayonetta 2. So nope.
4. Nope again, you miss my point entirely. Microtransactions in $60 games are in no way comparable to microtransactions in free-to-start games. Don't even try to compare them I mean really? Come on...
5. Nope, still doesn't change my point, many Halo fans were bummed out about 5, particularly the campaign, and well we have to go back to the last gen to talk about Sony's killer apps from their first party studios, Uncharted 3 did not love up to the hype, let's see how 4 does soon, I'm hoping it's excellent otherwise Uncharted will be a series with only one excellent game for me. Nintendo aren't the only ones who released half-hearted cheap games, see PlayStation All Stars Battle Royale for Sony and 90% of Kinect games for Microsoft.

And I could go on about the Vita for Sony and how scummy the Xbox One reveal truly was but I can see you're not going to change you're viewpoint so I'll just leave it at that. Nintendo are Kylo Ren representing the dark side who betrayed our trust whilst Sony & Microsoft are Finn coming back into the light side with their benevolent and brilliant actions wiping the slate clean of any and all bad things they have done in the past.

Or at least that's how it has to be on the Internet, particularly the short-sighted and hype driven gaming side of it. There has to be some battle somewhere with one side being bad because I say so and it is an irrefutable fact also because I say so. I do the Internet thing well I think.

Edited on by Shinion

Shinion

Grumblevolcano

@TheLastLugia: I'm not saying any of the 3 are perfect, infact this gen the free Nintendo Network service has been better than both XBL and PSN mainly due to stability. XBL and PSN has issues pretty often though Nintendo Network is only really unstable whenever Smash DLC comes out, Pokemon Bank came out or intended maintenance which has been known for several days. But last gen, XBL was better in quality than both PSN and Nintendo Wi-Fi Connection for sure which is why I said arguable. As for the other points:
2. Sure, any others you can think of?
3. It's still a 3rd party exclusive deal though, Nintendo could have turned down Platinum.
4. Devil's Third
5. I know but at the same time you could say the same thing about games like Splatoon. The launch content in that game was pathetic but the game evolved to be great. Yes, Halo 5's campaign was bad but the multiplayer is turning out to be the best in the franchise with those monthly content updates.

Don't forget that my comment #22 was about "failed" consoles so it was about the PS3, Xbox One and Wii U. We all know successful consoles allow the companies to abuse their power, what the main thing is about is treatment of the fanbase when their console isn't doing well. The Xbox One wasn't a failure until it came out so while the initial vision was horrific, the fact they listened to feedback from the fans and didn't do those things means a lot as they could have just gone straight ahead without making changes if they really wanted to. They also ditched Kinect in 2014 which was another thing that fans wanted.

I still think Wii U is the best current gen console and will probably keep that view whenever the end of the other 2 console lifecycles are but I feel Nintendo needs to be very careful about NX if it is infact a home console.

Edited on by Grumblevolcano

Grumblevolcano

Switch Friend Code: SW-2595-6790-2897 | 3DS Friend Code: 3926-6300-7087 | Nintendo Network ID: GrumbleVolcano

Peek-a-boo

Oh crap.

Patrick Klepek, the senior reporter at Kotaku, has done a chat on some broadcast-streaming thingy and says that this so-called 'PS4K' is in prototype stage and documentations (about it) exist too.

Bugger. This is going to be 'a thing' now, isn't it?

There's going to be incremental Xbox models, a 4K PlayStation, and the NX will be out sometime later this year too. Everything sounds so, so expensive all of a sudden!

Peek-a-boo

Pukentournament

Doubt it. Just because Nintendo is traditionally behind doesn't mean the console is going to die. It'll evolve again and like it did before. It was once just a gaming console then it turned into a mini sort of PC, then it'll gain control of most of the entertainment we get. When I see XB1 in homes I rarely see people playing games. They use it as an entertainment box.

Pukentournament

rallydefault

@Peek-a-boo: Just bopping in to say a couple things really quick:

1. The whole PS4.5 thing is ridiculous and, yes, a possible scary downward slope for all consoles. I certainly hope this sort of thing doesn't become the norm.
2. As Nintendo fans, do we really have any room to bedgrudge this, though? I mean... look at the New 3DS. Nintendo did practically the same exact thing. Same console. Same generation. More power. Buy it now or else you can't play certain games or have a MUCH inferior experience with games (Hyrule Warriors is the perfect example.).

And if we really want to bend the bar a bit, we can say that Nintendo has been pulling this sort of thing long before. Take the N64 and the Expansion Pack. Sure, it didn't cost the same as an entire console, but it was an upgrade that you NEEDED if you wanted to play certain games.

rallydefault

banacheck

Obviously with the launch of this generation the PS4 'won' the most adopters mainly due to it being the most powerful (if not by much),

The PS4 didn't win early adopters because of it's power that just helped, it was because the XboxOne launch was about TV & multimedia the launch didn't even have games. And then there was the fact it had to have an always online connection, & Phil Spencer telling people to #Dealwithit. I am really not surprised the XboxOne didn't do to well even with it's 180, & also Microsoft telling everyone it wouldn't change anything which they did in the end with there 180.

There will be another console from Microsoft XboxTwo or whatever they call it, Phil Spencer has already confirmed this when asked about consoles future. And there will be a PS5, Sony are already working on it. Consoles are going to be around for a few more generation's yet, for a few good reason's both companies have already talked about. But I will guarantee the media will talk about how the end of consoles as we know it will come soon, it happened last gen.

banacheck

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