Topic: Super Smash Bros. Ultimate

There's nothing inherently wrong with the Subspace Emissary. Just don't nerf character abilities (rip Captain Falcon and Sonic's speed), add more Nintendo characters to beat up, and have actual interesting level gimmicks like the first level you get to play as Donkey/Diddy Kong.

Mix the good parts of Subspace with Adventure Mode from Melee, make the mode just FUN to play through, and you got a killer single-player campaign. It doesn't have to be uber long like Subspace, just make it fun and worth replaying because it's fun.

And use actual Nintendo minions, like Smash Run does.

@EvilLucario I don't remember run speed being nerfed in Subspace Emissary, there's very few normal levels that let you run uninterrupted for long anyway plus, of course, you only get Sonic at the very end.

Anyway, the core gameplay of that mode works and I'd argue actually is fun, the uber length you mentioned actually is it's biggest problem, it just plain overstays it's welcome, not to mention the whole thing being pretty much Kirby Super Star: Smash Edition. Pretty much all the "gimmicks" found in Subspace (cannons, invincible mine carts, sliding launch pads) can be traced back to the former, up to and including The Great Maze Offensive.

We are likely at the point where a big overarching plot including all characters is probably too hard to pull off successfully, some characters are inevitably going to end up shafted or overexposed in the grand scheme of things, not to mention the modern-day potential DLC. Something more like classic fighting games where each character has their own small story to play through, perhaps with some mild randomization or path-choosing kind of like 3DS Classic could work.

Adventure Mode is probably Smash's best option for significant single player content at this point as the focus was franchises, not characters. Mario could have 2 levels (1 based on Super Mario Maker and 1 based on Odyssey), Zelda could have 1 based on BotW, Kirby could have 1 based on Super Star or Planet Robobot, DK could have 1 based on Tropical Freeze, etc.

And Fire emblem has 5 stages

I don’t really care if there’s another Subspace or not. If it’s there, cool. If it’s not, ok. I’ve never been one for single player campaigns in multiplayer focused games, something always just feels off, I can’t put my finger on it though. I will say Brawl was a nice departure from normal fighting game single player campaigns, your actualy doing stuff instead of just fighting the AI over and over. It was more so the levels themselves I wasn’t a fan of. So if it’s in the next game, that’s fine. If it isn’t, then I won’t be upset.

@TheTetrisGuy Fighting AI over and over probably is that feeling of emptiness you're describing. They just don't adapt and react the same way humans do, leading to tedium once you've got their patterns all figured out. There's a reason most "bosses" have to break the rules in some way to be a challenge.

Single-player that leans more towards Adventure Mode is our best bet in all honesty. Subspace barely worked with ~35 characters, with over 50 and counting that ain't happening with another attempt at Subspace. But I would still love stuff taken from Subspace, like an actual story. Perhaps have multiple different stories for different franchises? Idk how feasible that is though.

@EvilLucario You got a point on Melee's Adventure mode.Those levels were uniquely modeled and it had classic Nintendo enemies like Goombas and Redeads that were satisfying to beat up on.

@Tsurii I've never seen, met or heard anyone actually opposed to the idea of single-player campaigns in Smash, at worst it's just indifference from fighting game-savvy players who know they will almost never touch those modes again once they've gotten everything they can out of them. And no matter how good or substantial that campaign may be, it's difficult to say you're getting your money's worth out of a fighting game if you don't actually play with anyone and/or don't enjoy the core gameplay.

@EvilLucario If the stories are short, self-contained and draw inspiration from their franchise of origin or character, it doesn't seem so bad to implement. Smash doesn't really have an overarching plot to keep in mind like most other fighters, except maybe R.O.B's status as the last of his kind and Mr. Game & Watch being a shadow bug dispenser being referenced in Wii U.

Smash Bros will sell fine regardless of single player content but if they want Smash to go to the next level of mainstream success and really make some money then something good single player wise is going to have to be included. Just look how many people say they didn't buy Arms based on the lack of single player content.

@bluemage1989 Nah, it'll sell insanely no matter what due to brand recognition, it would have to be completely awful before sales start taking a noticeable hit. Smash Wii U was only limited by it's platform, and it was still one of the best-selling games on the system despite it's "weaker single-player content".

ARMS has the disadvantage of being brand-new and unfamiliar, but almost anyone who buys fighting games for single-player content is gonna end up disappointed. Dress up arcade modes or event battles as much as you want, in the end you're just fighting bots over and over. How many such modes can you name that are actually fun to play through for anyone not interested in getting better at the game and regardless of the quality of plot?

ARMS is uncompromising in it's identity as a fighting game, it's the type of game that has to sell itself on it's main gameplay, not bells and whistles like a story or side modes. It's why Brawl generally isn't as well-regarded as either Melee or 4, despite having some better content on paper. Splatoon has a somewhat more robust single-player, but only because it's gameplay can actually incorporate it well. It and ARMS both primarily tell a story through unlockable art instead of wasting time telling you about it in cutscenes (what little plot there is in the main gameplay only serves to move you along), in fact I think ARMS has deeper lore simply by virtue of having more defined characters instead of blank-slate avatars.

In the end, ARMS did and still is doing well for itself in sales, thanks to support from the developers updating the game and the player's dedication in exploring the strategies possible, which in my opinion, is proof that a fighting game doesn't NEED fancy single-player options to do well.

All that matters to me is a story mode similar to Subspace Emissary. Keep the cool cutscenes and light plot, but emphasize improvement to level design.

In particular they could make levels that cater to certain character's strengths. There's no reason to pick slow, clunky characters like Bowser or Ganondorf in Subspace Emissary unless you like making things hard on yourself.

I wouldn't personally care about a new Adventure or Subspace-esque mode, but I really hope they continue to expand on Smash Run. I put so many hours into that, and I still get a kick out of it to this day. So much fun.

@Sneaky_Beagle A single-player option to just fight in the labyrinth going for a high power-up score without the relatively meaningless final event would be dope.

Well, since a new Smash game IS happening, you know what that means....My dreams are going to begin tormenting me about characters that'll never make it in.

Of course I wake up early from a dream where Teen Titans made it in, bleh.

Stardew Valley character conformed for Smash 5

https://www.google.com/amp/s/mynintendonews.com/2018/05/06/sa...

... also the story mentions that Sakurai has a Steam account... it’s not the weirdest thing ever, but It did kinda throw me off lol.

I kinda liked the Subspace enemy types... didn't they use them for 100 man smash too?

@TheTetrisGuy He does have a collection of PlayStation games, so this isn’t too surprising.