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Topic: HD Rumble Thoughts

Posts 21 to 40 of 44

USWITCH64

It's good but bit pissed it's being left out of the switch lite which has no vibration at all. Would have bought one otherwise.

Edited on by USWITCH64

USWITCH64

Yorumi

One of the biggest issues for me is the cost. Both joycons and the pro controller are crazy expensive. While we don’t know the specific cost of hd rumble 8bitdo has a controller with most of the features of the pro controller for a good bit less. Of course the lite is removing it.

Sure it’s kind of neat but when it’s jacking up the price of controllers it’s not worth it to me with as underused as it is.

Yorumi

Nintendo Network ID: yorumi

ralphdibny

@Heavyarms55 it's a shame it's so underutilized I guess. Mario party is another one that sounds cool, especially with those dual switch screen sharing games. Unfortunately it's prohibitively expensive to experience as I doubt any of my friends would be interested in playing it! Probably one for the inevitable end of life sales...(I recently bought 3 copies of Tri force heroes for £8 each but still haven't found any friends willing to play with me lol)

@chardir yeah I agree about the multiplatform thing, it should be done better. There's a few multiplats I've got on switch for either platform exclusive bonuses or portability (not something I'm likely to sit in front of TV and play for ages)

ralphdibny

ralphdibny

@USWITCH64 @Yorumi I had no idea the switch lite omitted it. Maybe it will go the same way as the 3D in the 3DS (which was a damn shame, I really loved 3D games). Whether or not it's justified to me or everyone else, I believe Nintendo justify the cost with the HD rumble along with the NFC, motion controls, IR sensor and other mostly unused features. Each joy con separately is cheaper or the same price as a wii remote but obviously a second one is way more expensive than a nunchaku. Either way I am likely to cave for those purple and orange ones!

ralphdibny

Yorumi

@ralphdibny well the main point about the cost is I don't like paying for things that aren't going to be used. I don't doubt the tech costs what it does, what I mean is right now I can get controllers for literally half the price of joycons that do everything I need with the system. My biggest gripe with the switch was that there wasn't an sku that fit my needs which caused me to spend a lot more money than necessary.

They could have made an sku that didn't have joycons and instead just used a normal controller like 8bitdo sells and sold it for like $250. Instead I had to buy a system with two controllers that cause so much pain to my hands I can't use them, forcing me instead to buy the only other option at the time of a pro-controller which was also extremely expensive with tech I don't need. Of course the pro-controller for all its expense has a terrible dpad so for 2d games I had to buy yet another controller, fortunately I knew about 8bitdo then.

Yorumi

Nintendo Network ID: yorumi

ralphdibny

@Yorumi ah that's lame, I never really thought about it like that as I am at the other end of the spectrum and always want the top SKU but I always want to pay bottom dollar for it lol. My issue with the price is that I like to collect controllers so cheaper ones would make this more possible....

Ive never noticed that thing about the d pad but maybe I haven't played a game that's needed it with the pro controller (I have the Hori d pad joycon and an arcade stick).

Not that you'd want to spend more money or anything but when I was looking it up it said there was a work around for the d pad problem by using either tape or something like this:

Untitled

Also for the joy con there is a pair of official AA battery charging handles for them which I was thinking of getting as they look like they improve the ergonomics of them. Never did end up getting them though so I can't say if they do or not and thinking about it now I suppose they wouldn't work in handheld mode anyway if they slide into the joy con rail....

Edited on by ralphdibny

ralphdibny

Yorumi

@ralphdibny yeah I just never wanted to open up the controller, not to mention for 2d I like the dpad where the stick normally is. I've got controllers that work and the nice thing is 8bitdo ones work on a bunch of other things tool so they're a more universal controller. The main point of my little rant up there is just I wish Nintendo would think about the consumer a bit instead of beating their own chest with all the tech they crammed into a controller. When I play games I don't need hd rumble that's hardly used, or a ir camera that's not really used or things like that. I just want a controller with the standard functions and good quality buttons. That can easily be done at around a $40 MSRP.

I don't want to sound like I'm completely against innovation but at the same time if it isn't broke don't fix it. Lets take HD rumble since that's what the topic is about. I can almost guarantee the reason it's not heavily utilized is that it's hard to implement. It probably takes a while to get the feel just right and even then when you consider how games normally play how much benefit do you even get? What I mean to that latter point is if something crashes into my space ship there's not a lot of subtlety to that. If I'm playing a fighting game I'm still only holding the controller with my hands so it's not like I can feel the impacts on other parts of my body. Outside of minigame collections(1,2 switch, Mario Party etc) how do really implement it in a meaningful way?

It's kind of the same problem the wiiU gamepad had. Yeah that's kind of neat but how do you actually use it? To which we got mostly blank stares from Nintendo as they scratched their heads and thought "um we didn't think about that." Similarly how do we use HD rumble in normal games? *crickets.

They found a bit more use for the camera with labo but they couldn't see beyond their own extremely narrow educational vision but that's a whole different rant.

Yorumi

Nintendo Network ID: yorumi

ralphdibny

@Yorumi you raise some very interesting points and you are quite right. Maybe in future they could have some sort of "classic" and "pro" variations on their standard controllers.

With regards to the Wii u gamepad with standard games I would say maps all day. But like you said, I'd probably rather press pause to bring a map up in a game than pay another £100 to have it in my controller. I was gutted that breath of the wild didn't use the gamepad for anything except motion controls. It was probably the first Wii u game I played mostly with the pro controller that came with the 32gb model at launch!

ralphdibny

KarateLuigi

I'm a bit surprised nobody has mentioned Kirby Star Allies regarding "What can be done with it that can't be done with regular rumble?".

Rumble results in sound and by using different strengths you get different frequencies - which can be utilised to make music for example. Star Allies in particular has an easter egg where your controller(s) plays a short Green Greens bit in a crowning moment of awesome by using rumble alone and it blew my mind. I'm not going to claim that this is a must-have feature and whether it's worth keeping rumble enabled for things like these is everyone's personal decision to make, but it's certainly one very memorable moment which made it stand out a lot for me as it showcases what you can do with it if you're creative.

As for my personal thoughts I do keep rumble enabled and HD rumble can provide more extensive, detailed/precise tactile feedback - Mario Odyssey and Mario Party have been mentioned already - and make it more immersive for some as you can, say, feel how intense an explosion or whatever is, warn you when there's something large heading your way or make a way more authentic feeling heartbeat (e. g. Kirby Star Allies' final boss, Mario Tennis Aces uses a heartbeat rumble when a match reaches a crucial moment...). But I will say that extreme use of it is immersion-breaking for me due to the loud sound and as silly as it is I cannot help but get worried about my controllers if it's really intense. I think Super Bomberman R's story mode had a few moments where your controller(s) would go crazy for a fairly long time, but I digress. Ultimately I consider it a gimmick which can be used well and while I do use it by default and have been glad I did a few times already I wouldn't consider it an objective must-have. Might enhance immersion for some, might break it for others, depends a lot on how a game uses it, so don't sweat it if it's not your cup of tea.

Currently playing: ACNL, Overcooked 2, Super Kirby Clash, SNES Online, Story of Seasons, Mario Tennis Aces, Minecraft

Looking forward to: Luigi's Mansion 3, Pokémon Sword/Shield
Hyped for: ACNH, SNES Online

Last game I beat: Luigi's Mansion (3DS)

Chunkboi79

Imo, and I feel I might be in the minority, I think it's overrated. The only difference is that it seems to be timed differently so instead of a constant rumble when things happen. It is more precise on when it should rumble. So for the motorcycle on Mario Odyssey it does short bursts of rumble instead of a constant one kind of rumble.

The switch in handheld is so uncomfortable too that I almost never feel it since I use a grip which means I never feel it anyway. The only time I do is when I am playing with my pro controller.

Chunkboi79

pinta_vodki

No one's has mentioned Hollow Knight yet, so I'll chime in. I think the devs who ported it did an amazing job utilising HD Rumble. It's best when it's used not as a gimmick (though occasional inventive stuff like 1-2 Switch or finding moons by rumble only in Odyssey are undeniably fun), but as a subtle way of adding immersion to the game.

Hollow Knight does it really well: you get gentle taps when picking up coins, hitting enemies, landing after a jump, etc. I especially love the low-key rumbling when sliding down a wall.

There's been an article on the dev kit tools used to add HD Rumble to the game. You can drag a sound file and get a corresponding rumble pattern. This makes you feel the game events instead of simply hearing them. To bring up Hollow Knight once more, using abilities like double jump, dash or casting spells feels really satisfying and powerful with the rumble echoing the sound effect. Plus, unlike the loud generic rumble, it allows you to play games with sound turned off (e.g. past bedtime) and hear the sound effects through rumble. Which is kind of amazing when you think about it. Besides HK, picking up coins in Mario Kart is a great example.

You have to play with it on for quite some time and have an opportunity to contrast rumble on vs rumble off to really feel how good it is. When I switch (ha!) to a third-party game with no rumble or just the max settings BUZZZZ (I'm looking at you, Phoenix Wright), the superiority of carefully implemented HD Rumble becomes obvious. Likewise, I had a chance to play Hollow Knight on my friends PC with a PS4 controller and having no rumble felt like something was lacking. Almost like playing with sound turned off (which I know some people do and I can't understand such blasphemy).

pinta_vodki

ralphdibny

@KarateLuigi wow that's pretty awesome, the only sound thing I heard about was that santa tracker app playing the creepy rendition of jingle bells lol.

@Chunkboi79 I don't think your in the minority. This thread alone shows there is mixed reception to it. Some won't use it and some give glowing praise but mostly there is tempered reaction. I think I fall down the middle. I do think it's just a little bit too much like a phone vibrating, not in execution because naturally it is more diverse but just in how it feels. I think it would be better if the same level of fidelity could be applied to or combined with a more traditional rumble mechanism.

@pinta_vodki that sounds really cool! I can't play with the sound off or without rumble because I would feel like I'm missing something. I can do it on something that is grindy like crash team racing though where I am probably multitasking anyway. Funny that you play with rumble but no sound past bed time because if the rumble makes noise anyway you might as well have the sound on a bit too!

ralphdibny

skywake

CurryPowderKeg79 wrote:

I think HD has gotten out of hand it's like the early 90's when everything was extreme. They had extreme drinks and deodorant everything was freaking extreme. There's HD Paint for goodness sakes. Last i checked all paint was of HD quality and absolutely no controller rumble was in high def. Every decade or so marking idiots IMO grab on to some hot term and use it everywhere even where it doesn't belong.

To be fair "HD Rumble" better describes to the average person what the point of it is than calling it by it's actual name. If they had instead called it "Linear Resonant Accuators" or even "LRA Rumble" you wouldn't have a clue what they meant. HD Rumble? Oh yeah sure, it's rumble with more definition.

Which... is literally what it is. Put simply instead of having an off balance motor that's either off, slow or fast and has to ramp up/down? It can do pretty much any frequency you want and shut off as soon as you want. It's basically a speaker but with a weight instead of a diaphragm.

And once you realise what they're doing it's kinda easy to notice the advantages. If you pay attention you'll notice stuff like how getting a coin in Mario Kart "sounds" like a coin. The fact that it's "loud" I'd argue kinda adds to it. Like the speaker in the original WiiMote, it's not in your face but when used well it does add something.

Of course if you're going into it thinking it's a gimmick you've already made up your mind.....

Edited on by skywake

Some good Aussie musics: King Gizzard, Pond, TFS
"Don't stir the pot" is a nice way of saying "they're too dumb to reason with"

Silly_G

@ralphdibny : I was immediately taken aback by the fact that they had bothered to implement HD rumble as well as they have in the classic DOOM games. There are many moments of subtle (and not so subtle) vibrations throughout the games.

Silly_G

3DS Friend Code: 2578-3134-0847 | Nintendo Network ID: sillygostly

ralphdibny

@Silly_G I'll have to try with just the joy con then! I've only got 4 levels left of episode 4 to doo (boy those first few maps were gruelling and I am only on medium difficulty lol)

ralphdibny

Silly_G

@ralphdibny : I've completed the first three episodes in Ultra Violence for the first time ever, but episode 4 is simply ridiculous. It makes DOOM II look like child's play (episode 4 was released about a year after DOOM II).

Silly_G

3DS Friend Code: 2578-3134-0847 | Nintendo Network ID: sillygostly

ThanosReXXX

@skywake Nail on the head right there, times two.

To everyone commenting on how it's either underwhelming or not differential enough:
I have a very strong feeling that most if not all of you are either playing in handheld mode, or with the JoyCon Grip or with the Pro Controller, in which case the specific intricacies and subtleties of HD Rumble are largely lost or negligible.

If my suspicions are correct, then I strongly urge you to try again with the JoyCon detached. It really makes all the difference. It makes you feel weight, volume displacement, it adds to sound effects like some already mentioned, and it can, in some ways, even mimic pressure.

It truly is day and night, if you compare it to any kind of rumble or force feedback that came before it.
But to reiterate my previous statements, I do understand and take into account that some people will not be as sensitive to or aware of this, much like there are differences between people noticing differences in frame rates and/or quality of sound/music.

Be that as it may, though, the difference is most definitely there, objectively speaking. It's not just marketing blurb or whatever.

@Yorumi I'm kind of in agreement with you, but at the same time, also once again quite amazed at how Nintendo, especially with the Wii U, never really managed to realize it's full potential and/or use it as they probably intended to, especially seeing as their philosophy has always been the upside down pyramid, which basically entails that they always intend to first come up with the game concepts, and then think up the hardware that they should/would need to be able to realize those game concepts, instead of simply creating a box that can do whatever, like Microsoft or Sony, and then just dropping some game into that.

Edited on by ThanosReXXX

'The console wars are like boobs. Sony and Microsoft fight over which ones look the nicest and Nintendo's are the most fun to play with.'

Nintendo Network ID: ThanosReXX

ralphdibny

@Silly_G holy moly no way I could do ep 4 on that difficulty! I've been saving every 15 seconds of playing the levels well to get through them lol. I heard the later levels in the episode are easier tho 🤔

ralphdibny

Yorumi

@ThanosReXXX it’s funny that they make all these ways that hinder hd rumble. When the only way to truly experience it is with detached joycons it kind of says the tech just wasn’t ready. I find joycons horribly painful to use and so mine have hardly been touched.

I mostly just wish Nintendo would think this stuff through more. They do have interesting ideas but they’ve been failing to execute them well lately.

Yorumi

Nintendo Network ID: yorumi

SKTTR

HD rumble? I'm not feeling it. Even though I play with detached Joy-Cons all the time.

backloggery.com/SKTTR

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