Almost all of my games are purchased used. So I have a big problem with this if it comes to fruition. Especially since Nintendo seems to be allergic to dropping the prices of their games on the eShop.
It's really sad that forcing 20GB+ downloads on everyone, where we are told to just "leave it downloading over the weekend", because some people personally don't like to take the 3 seconds it takes to swap out discs is a legitimate train of thought going on these days. Why is switching physical media seen as this horrific practice that needs to be done away with? Sure, tell me about how having a discless console can reduce costs or chance of breaking. At least then I can see a valid reason, though I do not agree with it. But I cannot respect the reasoning of "I don't want to get up and switch discs", as if that is something that requires so much effort.
Almost all of my games are purchased used. So I have a big problem with this if it comes to fruition. Especially since Nintendo seems to be allergic to dropping the prices of their games on the eShop.
If we're talking about publishers and devs being "allergic" to dropping prices how about we actually consider what a used sale is. That money doesn't go to the publisher or the developer. So when you talk about prices, well used sales are part of the reasoning behind that price.
Conveniently we can do a comparison because there is already one platform where used sales are dead. Looking at the retail prices of some upcomming games in Australia for PC, PS4 and XBOne? Out of 7 upcoming multi-platform games at one of my local retailers 3 were $10AU cheaper on PC, 3 were the same price, 1 was $10 more on PC (Star Wars Battlefront). At retail. Before sales.
You quite literally pay for the ability to buy games used.
Why is switching physical media seen as this horrific practice that needs to be done away with?
Why do I stream movies on Netflix that I already own on disk? Because when I decide to watch a movie I don't necessarily know what I'm going to watch. Usually I'll just watch the first thing that comes up which interests me. It's the same with games.
When I think about how I play the games I own digitally vs the ones on disk? I'd rather have more digitally. Because I'll be constantly reminded of the games I own digitally with the ability to play them being a couple of taps/clicks away. Stuff on disk? eh. I own Smash Bros on 3DS on the cartridge, because of that Smash is always in the system. And because Smash is in my system I'm far less likely to finish other 3DS games I own on cartridge. On the Wii U I got Smash Bros digitally so when I want to play 10mins of Smash? I'm not putting whatever game I'm playing back on the shelf. I agree it's kinda stupid but ... that's just how it is.
I don't know how you come to this conclusion. I had a rubbish or even no internet connection for my whole life (except for a few years in a students dorm) so when I moved last winter, imagine how happy I was to finally get a fast internet connection. Still, I could've have that earlier if I had put that above other things. It was my own choice.
But maybe you just got me wrong. Let me put it this way: If someone decides to move to the countryside, they can't afterwards complain about slow internet. Because it's a known fact that the providers don't provide fast internet there (not because they can't, but because they don't want to). So they have to devide between fast internet and whatever it is that they love about the countryside.
So basically this:
Billions of people worldwide simply do not have access to the internet connection you have, and do not have the option to just pick up and move.
And it's not just about being in a rural area either. I live in a highly developed country (Canada) and an urban area. But Canada is a nation where three telecommunications companies have a de facto monopoly (tripoly? whatever) on internet usage and have apparently agreed amongst each other to screw over customers with data and bandwidth caps at a high premium.
According to a report from Ookla last year, Canadian internet ranks 54th in the world... for a country rated 8th on Human Development Index. Our internet is slightly better than Kenya, slightly worse than Mexico. Yeah.
So what options are available to Canadians who want better internet? Learn Spanish and move to Mexico? Please.
Well, like Nintendo said, the GamePad is going to stay, and NX isn't replacing Wii U. That is why I wouldn't be surprised if NX lacked a disc drive, and it is probably true.
NX = QoL platform with miscellaneous bells and whistles like VC, streaming and shared software = comfirmed(probably )
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3DS Friend Code: 4253-3737-8064 | Nintendo Network ID: Children
I don't know how you come to this conclusion. I had a rubbish or even no internet connection for my whole life (except for a few years in a students dorm) so when I moved last winter, imagine how happy I was to finally get a fast internet connection. Still, I could've have that earlier if I had put that above other things. It was my own choice.
But maybe you just got me wrong. Let me put it this way: If someone decides to move to the countryside, they can't afterwards complain about slow internet. Because it's a known fact that the providers don't provide fast internet there (not because they can't, but because they don't want to). So they have to devide between fast internet and whatever it is that they love about the countryside.
So basically this:
Billions of people worldwide simply do not have access to the internet connection you have, and do not have the option to just pick up and move.
To all the people being against it because of collector reasons: You should be well aware that optical discs are not a suitable medium to store/conserve things. They are the least reliable storage option there is. It takes between 5-15 years for them to become unreadable. So if anyone of you calls himself a real collector, you should be against optical discs.
sorry but this is the usual misinformed internet bullcrap told by people who want to convince us that digital is forever while optical media has a short lifespan. This simply isn't true. Companies are sued daily for digital data loss, while CDs have been around since 1984/1985 and you can still go to a record store and get a CD published 30 years ago and it'll still play.
Yes if CDs are mishandled they deteriorate, but so does everything else physical in life - deterioration didn't stop us from having china vases from 3000 years ago.
The "true collector" statement is simply ridiculous. In a few years we'll have the technology to rip 2015 games and turn them into worthless .iso files available everywhere on the internet for free, just like we are doing now with pre-8th gen games, so your digital collection will be as worthless as a .torrent file on a swedish tracker site.
Top-10 games I played in 2017: The Legend of Zelda Breath of the Wild (WiiU) - Rogue Legacy (PS3) - Fallout 3 (PS3) - Red Dead Redemption (PS3) - Guns of Boom (MP) - Sky Force Reloaded (MP) - ...
3DS Friend Code: 0104-0649-7464 | Nintendo Network ID: spizzamarozzi
Well, almost anything you buy, especially if it’s related to technology, decreases in value. Your disc based games too, you know.
But discs are a reliable medium, they are just singular in their entity. Digital is as reliable as the storage it is on, but is scalable to whatever the network it is connected to provides. Today and in the future, the survival rates of a decent cloud solution are going to be higher.
It's not a vehicle vs vehicle comparison, but more a case of infrastructure.
Here's another way to think about it. Physical media is only useful as long as you have something to play it back on. I have some old floppy disks with DOS games floating around, for example, but they're useless to me. Because I don't have a floppy drive in any of my computers. Hell, I only have a single (portable) DVD burner between my 3 machines.
Same is true for games. I have some of my old Gameboy games and the only reason I can play them is because I still have my Gameboy. My 3DS doesn't support the cartridges. And we can assume that will be true of 3DS cartridges 20 years from now on whatever the 2035 Nintendo platform is. If there is such a thing. However the games I get digitally? Nintendo knows I paid for those games. There's nothing stopping them from recognising those purchases in the future. Whether they do or not is another question but... there's nothing stopping them.
So if we're talking about permanence then digital wins. Even if the physical media is still readable doesn't mean you'll still have a system to play it on. With digital media even if your old console dies there's still a chance that you could play it.
Some playlists: Top All Time Songs, Top Last Year
"Don't stir the pot" is a nice way of saying "they're too dumb to reason with"
However the games I get digitally? Nintendo knows I paid for those games. There's nothing stopping them from recognising those purchases in the future. Whether they do or not is another question but... there's nothing stopping them.
Development costs, time, effort, technical limitations, desire, demand, interest, need...
Just a short list of the things that are/will stop them.
Here's another way to think about it. Physical media is only useful as long as you have something to play it back on. I have some old floppy disks with DOS games floating around, for example, but they're useless to me. Because I don't have a floppy drive in any of my computers. Hell, I only have a single (portable) DVD burner between my 3 machines.
another way to look at it and still wrong. Doesn't digital work under the same rules?! Don't you need something to play digital on, like - a computer or a console?! If your console breaks, you buy another one. If your floppy disk drive breaks, you can buy another one (you're just pretending you can't, but you could). It's 2015 and you can still buy gramophones to play wax records from the 1930s on. We don't know if all devices will support your iTunes purchases 80 years from now (that is, if you still can remember your account details).
People can praise digital for being practical and everything (although a world where people are getting so lazy that swapping discs has become an "effort" is a world worth nuking ASAP). But digital has zero inherent value. Old DOS games in digital form are worth even less than your old floppies.
The reasons why producers are investing so much on digital are all anti-users reasons.One is that it is cost convenient for them - but not for us. Second, it kills the second-hand market. Third, by making everything digital (including money transactions), people don't have the perception of how much they are spending - this is the same principle used by casinos. Fourth, you can't ask your money back if you have any problem with the product (how many of us should ask stupid Nicalis their money back for games that DO NOT WORK?!).
But if you people think digital is marvelous because you don't have to carry an extra carrying case the size of an audiotape to bring your 3DS games with you when you travel, you are welcome.
@shaneoh: yeah I mean "worthless" from a commercial point of view. Videogame preservation is extremely important.
Top-10 games I played in 2017: The Legend of Zelda Breath of the Wild (WiiU) - Rogue Legacy (PS3) - Fallout 3 (PS3) - Red Dead Redemption (PS3) - Guns of Boom (MP) - Sky Force Reloaded (MP) - ...
3DS Friend Code: 0104-0649-7464 | Nintendo Network ID: spizzamarozzi
Development costs, time, effort, technical limitations, desire, demand, interest, need...
Just a short list of the things that are/will stop them.
And yet the VC exists, remasters exist, ports exist. They ask for us to pay for these games over and over again every generation. And they get away with it because most people buy physical media.
another way to look at it and still wrong. Doesn't digital work under the same rules?! Don't you need something to play digital on, like - a computer or a console?! If your console breaks, you buy another one. If your floppy disk drive breaks, you can buy another one (you're just pretending you can't, but you could). It's 2015 and you can still buy gramophones to play wax records from the 1930s on. We don't know if all devices will support your iTunes purchases 80 years from now (that is, if you still can remember your account details).
Well for a start I think aac and mp3s already have far broader support than the physical formats for music ever did. Even as someone who does buy physical media for music (CDs) I still consume it 99% of the time as an mp3. It's gotten to the point where if you order a CD online from some places they'll give you a download link to the mp3 at checkout. Decades from now I'm pretty confident I'll still be able to enjoy my mp3s. I'm far less confident that I'll be able to easily find something working that'll play CDs. Let alone Vinyl. It's the same deal with consoles.
Besides if you can still buy the console you can still download it. I'm of course assuming Nintendo fixes the system where purchases are locked to a particular console. That's BS. But it doesn't have to be and I suspect they're going to fix that soon... as everyone else already has.
People can praise digital for being practical and everything (although a world where people are getting so lazy that swapping discs has become an "effort" is a world worth nuking ASAP). But digital has zero inherent value. Old DOS games in digital form are worth even less than your old floppies.
If it was about making a profit selling old games then sure. But I think that whole market is a load of crap, I'm not at all interested in that. The only value a game has is with the game itself. Which is why it's pretty awesome that a lot those old DOS games are available online now for free and legitimately.
And hell yes it's convenient, I rip my CDs for the same reason. I want to be able to shuffle through my entire collection, play different tracks from different albums on a whim. And I feel the same about movies and games. Does that make me "lazy"? Well you could argue that point if you want. But why shouldn't something that's for entertainment be more convenient? Isn't that what tech is all about? Next you'll be saying it's horrible that we use emails instead of the post!
The reasons why producers are investing so much on digital are all anti-users reasons.One is that it is cost convenient for them - but not for us. Second, it kills the second-hand market. Third, by making everything digital (including money transactions), people don't have the perception of how much they are spending - this is the same principle used by casinos. Fourth, you can't ask your money back if you have any problem with the product (how many of us should ask stupid Nicalis their money back for games that DO NOT WORK?!)
It's cost convenient for them, for sure. But also for us. It kills the second hand market for sure, but screw the second hand market. Remember Xenoblade? What about Amiibos? I am sick of scalpers, I am sick of the gaming retailers. I'm perfectly fine with cutting out the middle man. The point about hiding what's being spent? I don't see your point. I think it's pretty damn clear what's being spent. When it was points that was a joke but now it's actual cash. It's no less hidden than any purchase not done with literal cash in hand.
Lastly on refunds. Well I guess that depends on where you live. Under Australian consumer law they HAVE to give you a refund if the product isn't fit for purpose. I know for a fact that both Steam and Origin have this now. If other stores don't have it, digital or otherwise, then they should. But I think this is a problem not restricted to just digital purchases. At least with a digital purchase they know how many hours you've put into it. They know you're not gaming the system if you're being honest.
And yet the VC exists, remasters exist, ports exist. They ask for us to pay for these games over and over again every generation. And they get away with it because most people buy physical media.
What does any of that have to do with the advantages of digital files? So the only reason Nintendo released Windwaker HD was to take advantage of those people who bought the original game disc for GameCube? Because they otherwise wouldn't have made the game if the original was made available digitally? Huh? You aren't even making any sense.
And why bring up the VC? Digital files of games for the NES, SNES, N64, etc, never existed before. And if people still wanted to play those games and they still owned the physical carts, they could still play it on the original console.
My head hurts...
I'm far less confident that I'll be able to easily find something working that'll play CDs. Let alone Vinyl. It's the same deal with consoles.
Vinyl was a poor example to bring up, considering it is experiencing a resurgence in popularity with many new albums being released in that format, never mind the fact that you have been able to walk into a stereo shop and buy a turntable on any day the past 70+ years.
Next you'll be saying it's horrible that we use emails instead of the post!
Another horrible analogy/example. Comparing the 10 seconds it takes to swap out a disc with the days/weeks/months it takes for a letter to be delivered in the mail? Give us a break.
Remember Xenoblade? What about Amiibos? I am sick of scalpers, I am sick of the gaming retailers.
Hahaha you are nuts!
If you are cool with paying for digital files that aren't tangible and have no value to anyone else but yourself, more power to you, but I enjoy owning tangible media which retains value should I choose to sell or trade it. Whether physical or digital, 9 times out of 10 (especially when it comes to gaming consoles), you are still going to need to use the original hardware to play those titles.
Almost all of my games are purchased used. So I have a big problem with this if it comes to fruition. Especially since Nintendo seems to be allergic to dropping the prices of their games on the eShop.
If we're talking about publishers and devs being "allergic" to dropping prices how about we actually consider what a used sale is. That money doesn't go to the publisher or the developer. So when you talk about prices, well used sales are part of the reasoning behind that price.
Conveniently we can do a comparison because there is already one platform where used sales are dead. Looking at the retail prices of some upcomming games in Australia for PC, PS4 and XBOne? Out of 7 upcoming multi-platform games at one of my local retailers 3 were $10AU cheaper on PC, 3 were the same price, 1 was $10 more on PC (Star Wars Battlefront). At retail. Before sales.
You quite literally pay for the ability to buy games used.
Why is switching physical media seen as this horrific practice that needs to be done away with?
Why do I stream movies on Netflix that I already own on disk? Because when I decide to watch a movie I don't necessarily know what I'm going to watch. Usually I'll just watch the first thing that comes up which interests me. It's the same with games.
When I think about how I play the games I own digitally vs the ones on disk? I'd rather have more digitally. Because I'll be constantly reminded of the games I own digitally with the ability to play them being a couple of taps/clicks away. Stuff on disk? eh. I own Smash Bros on 3DS on the cartridge, because of that Smash is always in the system. And because Smash is in my system I'm far less likely to finish other 3DS games I own on cartridge. On the Wii U I got Smash Bros digitally so when I want to play 10mins of Smash? I'm not putting whatever game I'm playing back on the shelf. I agree it's kinda stupid but ... that's just how it is.
I must be in an apparent minority where switching discs for a game to play, even for a short time, isn't difficult and reason enough to just do away with discs. I can't respect anyone who uses that as their sole defense of an all digital console.
I'm waiting for someone to invent a product that allows me to go to the bathroom digitally. I'm sick of literally wasting 8 seconds each day when I have to flush the toilet. It's so aggravating.
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Topic: No Disk Drive?
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