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Topic: Everything Star Wars discussion thread| How you doing, you old pirate?

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the_shpydar

It's funny how many people are tripping over themselves to try and explain the "Dark Rey" thing.

Meanwhile, i'm old enough to remember the TV commercials for Return of the Jedi, where one of the final shots shown in some of the commercials was that shot of the Throne Room elevator door opening to show Luke, clad all in black, calmly standing next to Vader. We all know how that turned out, but it made for a great tease.

The Shpydarloggery
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gcunit

the_shpydar wrote:

It's funny how many people are tripping over themselves to try and explain the "Dark Rey" thing.

Laugh it up, fuzzball.

There's an explanation for it. People enjoy speculating about. What other shots from that trailer are as speculation worthy? I don't think the possibility that it's not what it seems is lost on as many people as you seem to imply.

What better way to celebrate than firing something out of the pipe?

Nothing is true. Everything is permitted.

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Octane

Star Wars is dead anyway. There's no point in speculating.

Octane

the_shpydar

@gcunit
No that wasn't my point or implication at all. I just find all the speculation funny, especially since so many "theories" about not only Dark Rey but plenty of other stuff are ridiculously outlandish or just outright stupid (see, for example, pretty much every "THEORY!" article on sites like CBR and such).

(Of course this isn't limited to Star Wars, it's pretty much across the board for any heavy-fandom geek-franchise, like the MCU, et al. And don't even get me started on what it was like reading theories during the last season of LOST )

The Shpydarloggery
She-Ra is awesome. If you believe otherwise, you are clearly wrong.
Urban Champion is GLORIOUS.

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gcunit

@the_shpydar My bad. Carry on.

YouTubers know they just have to come up with some semi plausible rambling to score a load of views. Star Wars speculation is one of the internet's oldest and favourite hobbies (maybe second only to sex), given that the Special Editions came out in 1997 and The Phantom Menace in 1999. From my perspective, it's what made the internet worth tolerating the dial-up modem experience for (I remember being in my school's IT room when I found out the trailer for TPM dropped, patiently waiting for it to d/l and then watching it in silence due to no speakers or not wanting to get found out). I've been a (fairly dormant) member of a Star Wars forum since 2000 I think, and when I found out such a thing existed it was amazing.

People desperately want this film to be good so are keen to invent interesting possibilities. But I think quite a lot of it goes overboard in the complexity for what are essentially family films (chopped off arms/hands/head, immolation, planetocide and the death of not one but two (and almost three) mothers notwithstanding).

Edited on by gcunit

What better way to celebrate than firing something out of the pipe?

Nothing is true. Everything is permitted.

My Nintendo: gcunit | Nintendo Network ID: gcunit

Heavyarms55

I don't think I ever mentioned it here but for anyone who liked Star Wars: Empire at War back in the day - the game is alive and well in 2019 with a bunch of really great mods. The "Remake Mod" gives the game a serious HD coat of paint and is mostly in line with the modern Disney owned Star Wars canon. Though I am much more of a fan of "Thrawn's Revenge" which is based on the old Expanded Universe (which I vastly prefer to the new material) and is set during the post-Return of the Jedi period right up until just before the Yuuzhan Vong War. It's an excellent mod that adds a ton of ships, heroes and various playable factions - the different fragments of the Empire after Palpatine died, the Chiss, the New Republic and the Corporate Sector Authority.

The game usually drops to like 5 dollars every Steam sale and the mods are free - and all you have to do is to download them in the Steam workshop. You do need the Steam version of the game though, the old physical releases don't have the officially patched in support for modding that the Steam version got a couple years ago.

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Dezzy

gcunit wrote:

People desperately want this film to be good so are keen to invent interesting possibilities. But I think quite a lot of it goes overboard in the complexity for what are essentially family films

I think this idea that Star Wars was meant for kids/families was very much a business decision they started pushing later on. I don't think it was originally intended that way at all.
If you think back to the original, in the first hour of the film you see Luke's family's burnt corpses, Han Solo murders someone and Obi-wan cuts someone's arm off leaving a bloody stump. All of that feels like it's aimed much more at an adult audience.
It's really not until the Ewoks that they start doing stuff that's specifically aimed at kids. Which they then continued heavily in the prequels, which are definitely trying to be more like family films.

Edited on by Dezzy

It's dangerous to go alone! Stay at home.

ScottNintendo

Octane wrote:

Star Wars is dead anyway. There's no point in speculating.

As much as I love Star Wars, unfortunately I'd have to agree. (blame Disney)

I still hope for a more adult Star Wars like the prequel trilogy, but that's never going to happen again.

Edited on by ScottNintendo

SN

gcunit

@Dezzy I wrote that comment fairly quickly, using the phrase 'family films' in a fairly rushed manner. What I was meaning was that they are (or at least were) designed to be universal.

I don't think they've ever been specifically aimed at kids alone in the way I think you're inferring. The ewoks were a unique case (and only really replicated by Jar Jar Binks in the prequels), and the appeal of them certainly must have played a part - Lucas wanted them to be cute. But in his early concepts for Star Wars he's said the climax was abattle involving a primitive society of Wookies against the Empire. By the time of RotJ a Wookie had already been seen and wasn't especially primitive, so he had to conceive of an alternative.

But kids were always part of the target audience. Star Wars was created as a swashbuckling monomyth, inspired by Flash Gordon, Robin Hood, fairy tales etc., re-writing classical myths and motifs around good and evil, heroes and villains. Before Lucas started working on Star Wars he'd been making Apocalypse Now and American Graffiti - he's said the fan mail he got from kids after American Graffiti was one of the things that helped him decide to park Apocalypse Now and start making Star Wars instead. He would run ideas past Francis Ford Coppola's 8 and 11 yr old kids and said they went crazy about the idea of a space film. He's also described it as an 'adult's kids' film'; taking the perspective of a 12 yr old; and said it is "not a story for children, but for anyone who likes the action adventure genre".

The two scenes you refer to just help tell the story of a farm boy facing some realities and it's not like those two specific shots of the corpses and the cut-off arm really reflect the rest of the film and didn't impact the the rating of the film significantly.

Edited on by gcunit

What better way to celebrate than firing something out of the pipe?

Nothing is true. Everything is permitted.

My Nintendo: gcunit | Nintendo Network ID: gcunit

Dezzy

This is the best thing you'll see all week:

It's dangerous to go alone! Stay at home.

redd214

Bought our tickets this morning, will be a fun way to spend Christmas eve morning, looking forward to it!

redd214

Cotillion

@Dezzy I know that's supposed to be funny, but it hits pretty close to home to how I actually feel about these movies

On the other hand, we are less than a month away from the debut of The Mandalorian which is the only Star Wars I am actually really looking forward to this year. I have high hopes for this show, it looks like it's a bit more mature and on the gritty side of the Star Wars universe.

Cotillion

Zeldafan79

I've been a star wars fan practically since birth and there's not a single movie i didn't like in some way. Yeah there's great ones and not so great ones but i like em all. Oh and you know how everyone hates Jar Jar with a passion? Well i honestly thought little Anakin was far more annoying. Largely due to Jake LLoyd's acting.

Anyway yeah it's gonna be interesting seeing what comes after Rise of skywalker. Maybe then we'll have no expectations going in and probably all new characters so the whole Disney ruined my childhood thing can be put to rest.

Oh and to the haters, If the christmas special didn't kill star wars nothing will. Star wars will out live us all.

Edited on by Zeldafan79

Zeldafan79

Cotillion

Zeldafan79 wrote:

Maybe then we'll have no expectations going in and probably all new characters so the whole Disney ruined my childhood thing can be put to rest.

I absolutely hated Episode 8. By far the worst in the entire franchise, IMO, and a terrible move in general.
With that said, I don't get the thing where people say "it ruined my childhood" or "took away the magic of the originals". Even though I hated that movie, I still watch and love the originals. They are still classics and I can rewatch them without even thinking of this sequel trilogy. Just like I can watch the original Terminator, Alien, Ghostbusters and so on without thinking of what the new ones have done. They are still just as great to this day and can still be enjoyed just as much.

Cotillion

Zeldafan79

@ Cotillion

True. Those movies you loved growing up still exist so nothing was ruined. Don't like the new ones? Don't watch em. Simple.

Zeldafan79

Dezzy

Cotillion wrote:

With that said, I don't get the thing where people say "it ruined my childhood" or "took away the magic of the originals". Even though I hated that movie, I still watch and love the originals. They are still classics and I can rewatch them without even thinking of this sequel trilogy.

I can only do this if they don't share the same characters, story arcs, settings. Like a Final Fantasy or Zelda game being terrible would never affect my love for the rest of the entries.

If they share any of those things, I just can't help feeling that a bad sequel/prequel detracts from the original to some extent (not always that much, but sometimes a lot).

I think the prequels, for example, did less damage to the original trilogy because they only made one character worse (anakin), whereas they also made one character a lot better (palpatine).
Whereas these sequels have made 3 original characters worse (the main 3) and not made any better. And I doubt either Lando or Palpatine will be improved by their presence in episode 9.

It's dangerous to go alone! Stay at home.

FullMetalWesker

@Dezzy - I can understand thinking they made Luke worse, but what did they do to Han and Leia to make them worse for you?

FullMetalWesker

Zeldafan79

I'm still trying to figure out what everybody's problem with the last Jedi was. The Luke being all negative thing? The Finn and Rose sidequest? Snoke basically being a nobody? Super Leia? All of the above?

Look I'm not sure what movie you guys were watching but that movie seemed pretty darn star warsy to me and i should know. Been a fan since the 70's. I had a good time.

I guess everybody wanted luke to take that lightsaber from rey and be all like, yeah let's go fight the bad guys and save the galaxy! Then during the final battle he'd come whooshing along in his X wing and say yeeeeeeee hawwwww! Take that you first order scum! Pew pew pew! kaboom! Kapow! Blammo!

Luke did say this wasn't going to go the way you think. You were warned.

Zeldafan79

gcunit

Zeldafan79 wrote:

Luke did say this wasn't going to go the way you think. You were warned.

Sure, because prior warning makes everything good.

The problem with the Sequel Trilogy so far (largely to do with The Last Jedi, because it covered it specifically) is that the entire story of Kylo Ren (and Luke Skywalker's exile) is explained by a short flashback (x3) that shows a master and uncle, who happens to be a galactic hero of 3 films btw, turn on his nephew because of... reasons (insert vague mutterings about Snoke - you know, Snoke, that uber force user we still know nothing about) while he slept.

George Lucas got criticism for Anakin's turn to the dark side being too sudden, and he made 3 films explaining it. Ben Solo's turn got 3 minutes, and we still don't know why his relationship with his parents broke down.

The entire sequel trilogy really hinges on that development, and it was portrayed in an unsatisfying manner. That is why the Luke Skywalker we got in the first 2 acts of The Last Jedi was hard to accept.

It's entirely possible that Ep.IX can mitigate that by adding further backstory, but for now The Last Jedi appears to underperform in it's role to justify the characters’ situations.

Edited on by gcunit

What better way to celebrate than firing something out of the pipe?

Nothing is true. Everything is permitted.

My Nintendo: gcunit | Nintendo Network ID: gcunit

FullMetalWesker

@Zeldafan79 - Dunno about anyone else, but I just found it to be a bit of a mess tonally. It's like they had a bunch of ideas that were just thrown in haphazardly without much thought put into whether it worked as an overall narrative. Sure, there were some ideas revolving around failure that I thought worked well, but then there was stuff like the 'yo mamma' joke Poe made at the start of the film, along with some character arcs which fell flat imo. Also, some of the traditionally great aspects of Star Wars (exotic aliens, locations and ships, engaging space and lightsaber battles etc.) weren't really present or were underwhelming in TLJ, which didn't really help matters.

FullMetalWesker

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