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Topic: Games You Feel are Overrated

Posts 461 to 479 of 479

Ralizah

CreamyDream wrote:

This first started with you saying Galaxy is tough as nails. I addressed it by saying "Nah it's an easy game aside from the postgame purple comets"

Tough as nails in comparison to Odyssey, not in its own right, like I said.

CreamyDream wrote:

It is safe to say that 3D Land's bossfights are the easiest of all 3D Mario games.

Probably. But not substantially easier. There's a very slight increase in challenge with Odyssey's bosses, but not enough to actually make most of them threatening.

Putting aside the Broodals, most of the unique bosses were easy as well (aside from Mecha Wiggler, which is the one really great boss fight in this game). They only posed any threat whatsoever when you fight their upgraded forms in the challenge paintings.

This is also balanced by the fact that the final fight with Bowser is pathetically easy in this game, whereas 3D Land's final Bowser encounter is arguably the most challenging in the series, requiring some tricky jumps and also being fairly drawn out, which, as you point out, makes it more of an endurance run.

I think they're fairly equal in this regard once you compare them fully.

CreamyDream wrote:

3D Land has a life counter, but the probability of you actually seeing the Game Over screen is very low due to the game having by far the most simple and least threatening level design of all 3D Marios

Even if you were to get a Game Over in 3D Land, the amount of progress you lose is miniscule. Levels range from about a minute to couple minutes long on average. Having to replay a level is barely a punishment.

In Odyssey, the punishment is also very miniscule but the amount of progress that you lose from being sent to the last checkpoint is usually larger than the progress you would lose in 3D World simply due to the larger and more complex nature of Odyssey's levels.

I disagree. Being forced to replay a level full of platforming challenges is far more of a "punishment" than getting docked 10 coins and being sent back to the last checkpoint, especially when there is usually very little in the way of obstacles between each checkpoint. Maybe if you ignore checkpoints and die frequently in Odyssey, but that wasn't my experience.

And are we talking about 3D Land or 3D World? Because you referenced them both here. Did you mean to do that, or was that a typo?

CreamyDream wrote:

On top of that, (this point is minor but still noteworthy) losing 10 coins directly impedes your progress towards several power moons and optional outfits in the game that require you to have coins. I personally found that to be a larger slap in the wrist than any punishment 3D Land offers.

10 coins is nothing in this game. You can gain that back in less than half a minute. Losing a life is a much more severe penalty.

CreamyDream wrote:

Next up, on top of 3D Land's level design being barebone and as simple as any 3D Mario game has ever gotten-
3D Land is mechanically far more simple than Odyssey as well.

Sure, it's more simple on a mechanical level, but there is more of an emphasis on precision platforming in 3D Land.

CreamyDream wrote:

Odyssey has many mechanics and the game challenges you with learning every single one.

You can get through the bulk of Odyssey with some pretty basic jumps, so I disagree here.

CreamyDream wrote:

3D Land simply doesn't. It's a far more simple game all around.

Sure, but a game being simple doesn't necessarily make it easier. Some of the hardest games ever made are incredibly simple.

CreamyDream wrote:

Oh and btw, this is all without even taking into account the fact that 3D Land has the Golden Tanuki powerup, which pretty much assures the notion that 3D Land is objectively easier. Even without it", my argument still stands.

No, it means that 3D Land objectively has an easier easy mode. Nothing more.

CreamyDream wrote:

Odyssey's final challenge asks you to keep track of far more mechanics than there are in the entirety of all of 3D Land, and Odyssey's is just longer.

You hit on it with that last part: there's really very little that's hard about the final challenge in Odyssey, it's just a longish slog that gives you more room for error. There's no one activity in it that really challenges you at all.

3D Land's final challenge requires expert platforming. It's shorter, yes, but also a more worthy test of skill. And, having played both games, I also found it to be far more challenging.

Whereas, to quote you, "Odyssey's is just longer."

CreamyDream wrote:

I dont think it's worth my time to go into the same level of depth for 3D World, not only because 3D World is more difficult than 3D Land, but because I think I've proved my point as to why it's inconsistent of you to complain about Odyssey being easy and not 3D Land.

I believe I've said multiple times that 3D Land is an easy game. I just don't think it's easier than Odyssey.

Edited on by Ralizah

Switch FC: SW-2726-5961-1794

gcunit

I was really looking forward to Odyssey, avoided spoilers for a couple of months prior to launch, and picked it up on release day.

5 weeks on and I've played less than 10 hours. I don't feel that need to play it.

Objectively.

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Objectively what?

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Octane

@Ralizah Wooded Kingdom is one of the best tracks in the game!

Octane

CreamyDream

@Ralizah

Edit: oh btw, I meant Land, not World. Sorry, i got the names mixed.

So i see the two main points as to why 3D Land is harder are that:

3D Land consistently has precision platforming whereas Odyssey doesnt or rarely does

And Odyssey, despite having far more mechanics, rarely ever makes you use them.

I think both of these points are very flawed.

You're correct that, unlike Odyssey, Land is entirely comprised of platforming challenges.

However, they really dont require much precision. In fact, I wouldnt find them to be any more substantial than the red door challenges in Odyssey.

The platforms in 3D Land are usually very large, allowing for a lot of room for error.

The comparable moments of platforming in Odyssey like the flipping platforms in the Luncheon Kingdom or the scooter course in NDC require more precision and have less room for error. There are also no checkpoints within those rooms.

The camera in 3D Land is always fixed, meaning that the player never has to worry about camera placement and visibility for placing jumps. The platforming not only doesnt require much precision, but never requires creativity on part of the player.

In Odyssey, not only is there a healthy amount of straightforward 3D platforming, but the player also has to coordinate with the camera placement and the larger amount of mechanics.

Lives are very plentiful in 3D Land. I'd be surprised if you, or anyone in this forum has seen the Game Over screen in 3D Land. On top of the levels being very short, theres checkpoints as well, meaning youll pretty much never be sent further than half a level back if you die.

You simply do lose more progress in Odyssey if you die, and you lose valuable in-game currency.
All you lose in 3D Land is progress, and not much at all.

On top of that, Odyssey has an element of challenge that 3D Land has little to none of- exploration and puzzles.

Your argument that the notion that Odyssey doesnt require you to learn all its mechanics to progress makes Odyssey easier than 3D Land is very flawed too, and for several reasons.

You say you can get through Odyssey with only "simple jumps", right? Therefore the more advanced maneuvers are optional and reserved for advanced players?

Sure, but in 3D Land, what other options do you even have? All there is in 3D Land are simple jumps and the occasional (and entirely optional powerup). Even if 3D Land wanted to push your abilities, it couldnt and never does except maybe in the postgame.

Moreso than that, you have pointed to 3D Land's final challenge level vs Odyssey's as a reason as to why 3D Land is more difficult.

Deeming Odyssey's advanced moves to be optional, then pointing towards the post-game as a point in your argument is nonsensical because to get to that point in the post game (without abusing the optional shop) and to beat that final stage in Odyssey, those advanced moves are mandatory.

If you want to adjust your argument to not include the optional postgame, then sure, but that means you would have to do the same for 3D Land's optional postgame, which is the only part of 3D Land that presents any semblence of difficulty.

Also, even without vanilla Mario's advanced moves; if youre stubborn enough to get through Odyssey's maingame (without postgame) just through simple jumps-
The mandatory captures you have to use still make it so that the player has far more mechanics to learn and master in Odyssey than in 3D Land.

Another edit: i forgot to point out that you say "the unique bosses in Odyssey are easy too" which youre 100% right about.
Odysseys bosses are baby easy.

... But as opposed to what in 3D Land? 3D Land manages to be even easier than those.

Oh and you never actually told me why the Golden Tanuki doesnt invalidate your argument. You just called it "optional". Fact is, it's there for me to use. Odyssey has an easy mode and the gamebreaking coop feature too but that aint as OP as the Gold Tanuki

Edited on by CreamyDream

CreamyDream

darkfenrir

Outside of the Mario Odyssey talk... although after going into hype, bought it as fast as i can and finish it... I don't find much in me to try getting more moons afterwards (especially when my backlog now started to stare at me, and okami HD releasing in a few days and my work starting too, haha...)

I find that the Digimon Story: Cyber Sleuth is... kind of good, and it's not bad of a game overall but. It just made me wish for a Digimon World game that is localized to somewhere I can play (I have watched the Digimon World Next Order, and it feels weak vs the Re:Digitize Decode which Bamco didn't even localize )

The two digimon being trained at once made me think it lost some focus, since it makes you feel to have two pets vs one, maybe it should be like, a choice for players (?) but then again that will play a lot to the difficulty so I guess nothing to do about it.

darkfenrir

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Caldorosso-E

My hot take: Deus Ex: Human Revolution is overrated.

I'd heard great things about it, so I purchased Deus Ex classic to see if I liked it. I didn't. I loved it.

Fantastic world, systems, and level design. One of my easy top 10. Then I play HR.

It's good, but nowhere near as great as the original. That's really a problem with a ton of sequels, huh?

Edited on by Caldorosso-E

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Snaplocket

@Caldorosso-E That's debatable, 9 times out of 10, the sequel is better. It's actually very rare for the first in a series to be the best. The only game I can think of where the original is undeniably better then the sequels is Walking Dead Season 1 and MAYBE Pikmin 1 (I personally find the third game better, but just barely). If you're talking about a particular game in a series compared to the latest game, then it's another story.

Snaplocket

Arminillo

Snaplocket wrote:

@Caldorosso-E That's debatable, 9 times out of 10, the sequel is better. It's actually very rare for the first in a series to be the best. The only game I can think of where the original is undeniably better then the sequels is Walking Dead Season 1 and MAYBE Pikmin 1 (I personally find the third game better, but just barely). If you're talking about a particular game in a series compared to the latest game, then it's another story.

Valkyria Chronicles
Xenosaga I > Xenosaga II
All other Dragon Age > Dragon Age II
Devil May Cry > Devil May Cry 2
Final Fantasy X > Final Fantasy X-2
Legend of Zelda > Adventures of Link

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Snaplocket

@Arminillo Fair enough, but that's five games out of, who knows how many video game franchises there are. Also, it's kinda debatable whether or not Valkyria Chronicles II is flat worse then the original. (Never played it cause y'know, PSP. Didn't play the original much either.)

Edited on by Snaplocket

Snaplocket

The64Master

Horizon: Zero Dawn is pretty overrated. The combat is incredibly boring to me.

The64Master

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Caldorosso-E

I have't played it, but I hear the same on HZD.

Love all, trust a few, do harm to none.
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shaneoh

Caldorosso-E wrote:

My hot take: Deus Ex: Human Revolution is overrated.

I'd heard great things about it, so I purchased Deus Ex classic to see if I liked it. I didn't. I loved it.

Fantastic world, systems, and level design. One of my easy top 10. Then I play HR.

It's good, but nowhere near as great as the original. That's really a problem with a ton of sequels, huh?

Considering that Deus Ex is nearly the perfect game, it would be a tall order for any sequel to match it, let alone exceed it. Still, Human Revolution did feel pretty generic.

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Operative2-0

I've said it before but since I've just played through the "story" DLC, I'll say it again, botw is not all that once it's said and done, DLC included.

But other than that thankfully most of my opinions for major games seem to be in line with most others, so that's a relief for once.

Edited on by Operative2-0

Operative2-0

NaviAndMii

Most modern FPS's...having a memorable story, meaningful difficulty levels, local co-op and competitive local multiplayer (amongst others) - all of which used to be staples of the genre - just seems like too much to ask for these days

Instead, we just get lumbered with unoriginal shooter after unoriginal shooter - each one almost indistinguishable from 10-or-so other games on the market - and each complete with its own uniquely toxic online community...and we, as players, either have to endure it or just find another genre of game to play altogether! **grumble grumble**

I just don't get any sort of buzz when I see a 'new' reveal for 'ToxicTeamShooter 7' or 'FacelessRobotManFightsAliens 9' or 'UniformedEverymanFightsInAHistoricalBattle 42' - give me something interesting!

I mean, jeez, the apparent 'Shooter of the Year' (PUBG) was an Early Access jankfest! ..if that doesn't tell you everything you need to know about the state of the genre, I don't know what will! ..but, sadly, I can almost guarantee that larger publishers are going to look at that game and think 'Ooo! Battle Royale must be the new #trend! We need to make one TEN of those!' rather than 'Ooo! Look! They came up with something kind of original and it caught on, maybe we should try doing that?!' (<- yes, yes you should!)

Aside from graphics and connectivity, the whole genre (with very few exceptions) just seems to have gotten stale and, frankly, gone backwards for the best part of a decade in my opinion...

(I hope that Nintendo try and make an original FPS of their own at some point, because they're one of the few publishers that actually seem to put creativity before marketability! ..I'd be so delighted to hear that Retro (for example) have been making their own, fresh, new FPS IP - because at least I'd actually have some confidence that it may be something distinctly different from anything else we've had to endure for the past few years! **fingers crossed!**)

Edited on by NaviAndMii

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Moviefan2k4

I tend to feel most sports games are overrated, along with a lot of first-person shooters like "Halo" and "Call of Duty". I also can't stand "Grand Theft Auto", which basically tells kids its okay to deal drugs, steal cars, and beat up random women because "its just a game".

God, guns, and guts made America; let's keep all three.

EvilLucario

GTA is rated M for a good reason though. It's not rated suitably for kids.

EvilLucario

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shaneoh

Moviefan2k4 wrote:

I also can't stand "Grand Theft Auto", which basically tells kids its okay to deal drugs, steal cars, and beat up random women because "its just a game".

Only the really stupid ones think the game is telling them those things are okay.

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Seacliff

Going to get so much hate for this.

Secret of Mana

Sometimes, I can accept a game isn't for me and still see why people love it. But I can't see that here. The battle system is heavily flawed, acting as a wishy washy ATB battle system that tries too hard to be a proper Action RPG.

The presentation is nothing to write home about, the graphics are indeed colorful but fail to create a tone outside 'general lightheartedness'. And only a few music tracks stood out from forgettable (The Boss theme is pretty good at least). The story is absurdly simple and the characters are poorly written as if they had multiple writers that never checked each other's works.

SD3 improved the formula a good bit, and I think it's an okay game for it. Shame it was never localized.

Seacliff

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