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Topic: Earthbound/Mother isn't dead

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Hokori

61. Posted:

Yeah think about it the way Kid Icarus was revived, the 3D Classics wasn't a remake in the way people think about remakes, but a remake non the less

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WaLzgi

62. Posted:

Ah well, they could still make it a digital only release and then everyone would be happy :P

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WaLzgi

63. Posted:

Hokori wrote:

Yeah think about it the way Kid Icarus was revived, the 3D Classics wasn't a remake in the way people think about remakes, but a remake non the less

Actually Kid Icarus is a good example. Fans wanted the series to return and there wasn't a release for 21 years (or 25 in Japan since OM&M wasn't released there until VC).

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AlexSays

64. Posted:

CanisWolfred wrote:

You're talking as if every game needs to be wildly successful. There just needs to be enough demand, and it just needs to be successful enough to make a profit. What, you think NIS, Atlus, and XSEED run a charity? No, enough people are actually buying what they sell to keep them going. And what they sell are extremely niche games. Honestly, as long as they don't throw millions of dollars at the game, they'll be fine with a series revival in this day and age, especially considering the fact that Earthbound/Mother has more fans that your usual lost series.

When reviving a franchise that had ONE release outside of Japan... yes, it needs to at least have a chance at being wildly successful. Those companies you mentioned also publish games for the most part, they do not risk development time on most titles.. You're asking a developer to take a chance on bringing back a franchise that has only seen one release over a decade ago in 99% of the world. You're also asking a developer to take on a game in which the relatively few fans that do exist have astronomical expectations.

That's not being reasonable at all. As Iz said, find a way to release the game as a downloadable game. Then review it's success and go from there.

We're discussing this game though as if everyone and their mother (unintentional also) knows about Earthbound. We need to remember, this game wasn't even THAT popular when it was released ages ago. And it only had one release. For the vast majority of people, this game would be as familiar as any other random game on store shelves. Therefore you need much advertising to cover many sales to cover much development time and legal expenses. It's not easy, and if nobody is willing to step forward we need to collectively move on and say screw it.

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Final-Starman

65. Posted:

EarthBound wasn't a smash hit when it came out because Nintendo failed to give it good marketing. I've replayed EarthBound for about ten times now, and I still haven't gotten tired of it.

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kkslider5552000

66. Posted:

ok so NOA isn't the only people who still believe Earthbound isn't at least somewhat popular.

Yes a game that like every other self-proclaimed "Nintendo fan" has played and has one of the most notable online communities isn't popular because it didn't sell on the SNES in 1995. I'll be sure to tell Pulp Fiction fans how Pulp Fiction isn't a popular movie or that Star Trek is still as niche as it was when the first series aired.

Edited on by kkslider5552000

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AlexSays

67. Posted:

kkslider5552000 wrote:

Yes a game that like every other self-proclaimed "Nintendo fan" has played and has one of the most notable online communities isn't popular because it didn't sell on the SNES in 1995. I'll be sure to tell Pulp Fiction fans how Pulp Fiction isn't a popular movie or that Star Trek is still as niche as it was when the first series aired.

You are delusional. You cannot separate yourself from reality when it comes to any topic, ever. We go through this process every thread..

There was one game, over a decade ago, that wasn't even popular. The large majority of consumers are not 'self proclaimed Nintendo fans'. They are regular, normal people. Not you. The large majority of people do not go on Earthbound forums. They do not take part in the Earthbound community. The very large majority of people have never heard of Earthbound. It's not worth the risk for most devs to take on a project that is not known outside of internet forums.

Star Trek was pushed onto people throughout TV history. Pulp Fiction was shown on TV and throughout theaters several times. Earthbound has had ONE RELEASE. Over a DECADE ago.

You people act as if there have been great signs of Earthbound for the past 15 years. There hasn't been. The series has been dead. Get your head out of the clouds and at least pretend to relate to the average consumer.

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kkslider5552000

68. Posted:

AlexSays wrote:

kkslider5552000 wrote:

Yes a game that like every other self-proclaimed "Nintendo fan" has played and has one of the most notable online communities isn't popular because it didn't sell on the SNES in 1995. I'll be sure to tell Pulp Fiction fans how Pulp Fiction isn't a popular movie or that Star Trek is still as niche as it was when the first series aired.

You are delusional. You cannot separate yourself from reality when it comes to any topic, ever. We go through this process every thread..

There was one game, over a decade ago, that wasn't even popular. The large majority of consumers are not 'self proclaimed Nintendo fans'. They are regular, normal people. Not you. The large majority of people do not go on Earthbound forums. They do not take part in the Earthbound community. The very large majority of people have never heard of Earthbound. It's not worth the risk for most devs to take on a project that is not known outside of internet forums.

Star Trek was pushed onto people throughout TV history. Pulp Fiction was shown on TV and throughout theaters several times. Earthbound has had ONE RELEASE. Over a DECADE ago.

You people act as if there have been great signs of Earthbound for the past 15 years. There hasn't been. The series has been dead. Get your head out of the clouds and at least pretend to relate to the average consumer.

I'm not saying it's the most popular thing ever, but it's popular enough that at the very least it would make a decent profit if released in North America. The average consumer doesn't care about many games that were successful, and I don't think it necessarily matters that they do. This is especially true since this year Kid Icarus Uprising came out this year and has done quite well for itself, which is also a series only hardcore Nintendo fans tend to care about that was dead for an absurd amount of time and only gained popularity because of Smash Bros and slowly gaining a fanbase because of people discovering the games throughout the past decade and a half or so.

Edited on by kkslider5552000

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Chrono_Cross

69. Posted:

You're not getting his obvious point though. There is no demand for the Earthbound series outside of Japan.

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the_shpydar

70. Posted:

The comments in this thread are a perfect example of why i think @AlexSays is awesome (granted, the Snoopy avatar doesn't hurt). :)

Earthbound is a good game, yes. Quite good. I enjoy it tremendously. It makes me laugh,and hits me with both of those great gamer-experiences of "yes! awesome!" and "crap! how can i beat this guy!".

That being said, it is insanely overrated by Nintendo fans and fanboys. It was never profitable in the West, and was basically on the borderline of being a huge flop. It did in fact have a fairly extensive marketing capaign targeted at the fanbase (you couldn't open a comic or youth-oriented mag without seeing an ad), but no dice.

It's developed a fairly vocal cult following over the years, but honestly, so have plenty of games, movies, books, comics, etc. A loud vocal minority on the internet (many of which have no money of their own and rely on mommy and daddy to maybe buy the stuff they like) in no way translates into an actual substantial marketplace such that it would be in their best interests financially.

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kkslider5552000

71. Posted:

CactusJackson wrote:

You're not getting his obvious point though. There is no demand for the Earthbound series outside of Japan.

Well is the point that America has nothing to do with whether a new...anything in the series is made? Well yeah, but I'm talking about localization. It would exist because these games succeed in Japan and then they would succeed and make a profit in America if localized.

the_shpydar wrote:

A loud vocal minority on the internet (many of which have no money of their own and rely on mommy and daddy to maybe buy the stuff they like) in no way translates into an actual substantial marketplace such that it would be in their best interests financially.

Honestly I remember there being a lot of 20-somethings at Starmen.net and even outside of it for Earthbound fans. I mean Ness was in the first 2 Smash Bros where a large chunk of people discovered the games, and both of those games came out over a decade ago.

and "loud vocal minority" = JRPG on a Nintendo system that would not sell only works if you can convince me Earthbound is less popular than Xenoblade Chronicles, which did make a decent profit.

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Chrono_Cross

72. Posted:

kkslider5552000 wrote:

CactusJackson wrote:

You're not getting his obvious point though. There is no demand for the Earthbound series outside of Japan.

Well is the point that America has nothing to do with whether a new...anything in the series is made? Well yeah, but I'm talking about localization. It would exist because these games succeed in Japan and then they would succeed and make a profit in America if localized.

There's no demand for it in the United States. A localization of any kind would be pointless for Nintendo.

Unless there's some sort of petition with one million+ signatures of people who have $40-60 waiting to buy an Earthbound, Mother sequel, port or remake, then Nintendo has no reason to develop, let alone even discuss, another game for the franchise. Wasting money and time isn't exactly "fun" for businesses.

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AlexSays

73. Posted:

If it doesn't have name recognition, it must evolve like the example you presented. Nintendo took Kid Icarus, made it into an entirely new game, and advertised it around the world. The same would have to happen to Earthbound, like I've said previously. Nintendo invested a ton between advertising and development to make sure Kid Icarus would sell some, and even then I believe it has failed to meet a million units. Not exactly an encouraging sign for the future.

Factor in the legal expenses that would be added onto what Kid Icarus cost, and it's a high cost, potentially low reward game to make. Even if every self-proclaimed Nintendo fan purchased the game, it would still have to sell a lot more to cover costs much less make a profit.

I'm not in favor of asking a dev to put their money and time on the line for a game just because I personally like it. I think that's selfish. If someone wants to test the market, find a way to release the original as a downloadable game. Determine the fraction of Wii Shop consumers that purchased the game, find a correlation between market success on store shelves and through the downloadable market, and apply that correlation to determine if the game is financially feasible.

Like I've said countless times, if there was tons of guaranteed money to be had here, this series would be alive and well. Money does everything. No game has made tons and tons of money, and magically disappeared. We're basically waiting on someone to finally take the risk, and it's discouraging to see people still living in the past and holding their breath until this series is revived. If someone takes on the project, great. But it makes no sense to wait decades upon decades for something that'll likely never happen.

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kkslider5552000

74. Posted:

CactusJackson wrote:

kkslider5552000 wrote:

CactusJackson wrote:

You're not getting his obvious point though. There is no demand for the Earthbound series outside of Japan.

Well is the point that America has nothing to do with whether a new...anything in the series is made? Well yeah, but I'm talking about localization. It would exist because these games succeed in Japan and then they would succeed and make a profit in America if localized.

There's no demand for it in the United States. A localization of any kind would be pointless for Nintendo.

Unless there's some sort of petition with one million+ signatures of people who have $40-60 waiting to buy an Earthbound, Mother sequel, port or remake, then Nintendo has no reason to develop, let alone even discuss, another game for the franchise. Wasting money and time isn't exactly "fun" for businesses.

I present you my rebuttal to "no demand for it" and localization not equaling profit in my previous post.

Beyond that, I think you're missing what I'm saying. America has nothing to do with a new Mother game or anything. Japan does. My point is exclusively on whether after this game would make a profit in Japan do I think localization of a new game or whatever would make money. I think it would for reasons already stated. I completely understand NOA's logic and why they will never localize these games again, I can't blame them really.

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Chrono_Cross

75. Posted:

If there's no demand for it in the United States or Europe, then there's no localization.

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AlexSays

76. Posted:

Also, before people start worshiping Itoi for posting something about Earthbound.. Remember this is the man entirely responsible for keeping the series dead all this time.

If he was this honorable gaming developer that cared for the 'Earthbound community' he would have done something this past decade. Now it sounds like he's interested in getting Earthbound on the VC to test the market and make some money.

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kkslider5552000

77. Posted:

CactusJackson wrote:

If there's no demand for it in the United States or Europe, then there's no localization.

There's been more demand than Xenoblade Chronicles or the Last Story. Not every game needs millions of dollars of advertising.

AlexSays wrote:

If it doesn't have name recognition, it must evolve like the example you presented. Nintendo took Kid Icarus, made it into an entirely new game, and advertised it around the world. The same would have to happen to Earthbound, like I've said previously. Nintendo invested a ton between advertising and development to make sure Kid Icarus would sell some, and even then I believe it has failed to meet a million units. Not exactly an encouraging sign for the future.

you're assuming that every game Nintendo releases needs the AAA advertising treatment. More limited releases and using XSeed and the like to help publish the game for cheap is not a bad thing. I thought it was stupid when Nintendo used decent sales for Sin and Punishment on VC to assume that tv advertisments would make the sequel into some huge success. That was very clearly never going to happen. All fans really want is for the games to be released legally in North America.

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Chrono_Cross

78. Posted:

Earthbound =/= Xenoblade or The Last Story.

As previously mentioned, Earthbound is outdated compared to today's standards in the JRPG genre.

Edited on by Chrono_Cross

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FOREST_RANGER

79. Posted:

AlexSays wrote:

If he was this honorable gaming developer that cared for the 'Earthbound community' he would have done something this past decade.

Well, he helped in the production of MOTHER 3, a Gameboy Advance game. That was released in Japan in 2006, according to Wikipedia. Not sure how it performed in sales though.

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AlexSays

80. Posted:

Limited releases and no advertising = very little sales. Very little sales = a net loss for the developer and publisher.

You're basically stating this game should be released just so that the fans can play it again. There aren't enough fans to make it financially feasible. There aren't millions of people in this magical 'Earthbound community'.

Like that Cactus man said, if there were a petition with a few million signatures I could see where you're coming from. Without any form of evidence, I have no choice other than to believe you're grossly exaggerating how large the fan base for this game is.

And if it was 'easy money' as you make it out to seem, it would have been done already.

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