Topic: Anime & Manga (NO SPOILERS PLEASE)

@RR529 - Yeah, the next volume's the last, so I've been told there's probably only...~4-7 chapters left, I guess. The higher end's probably just me being overly cautious, though. Probably more like 3-5 chapters, but I wanna be safe, man. The anime nazis are pretty scary if you make a mistake, as you've you've very well seen.

So I watched Bananya and New Game! today. I'll probably stick with Bananya just for kicks and giggles, but New Game! was really good. It's about a high school graduate named Aoba who starts her job at a video game company. It's the usual slice of life kind of deal but I'm hooked. I'll probably watch Orange tomorrow.

Speaking of Slice of Life, I resumed Grimgar of Fantasy and Ash, which I guess you can call a "Fantasy Slice-of-Life/Drama" at this point. I'm up to episode 9, and the "drama" part of that really hit home with me the past 4 episodes. It helps that this series keeps going beyond my usual expectations - the action is great, but not really the focus like you'd expect from the premise, which in and of itself screamed "RPG-meets-Reality" a-la Sword Art Online and Log Horizon, but a lot of that is left so far to the backround that it's arguably just left up to viewer interpretation, especially due to the fact that none of the cast can remember their old lives before becoming "volunteer soldiers." And of course, the slower bits are much more well-written and interesting than I ever expected. At the very least, every character has their quirks, and there's some of the most natural character development and interactions that I've ever seen. It still feels a little rushed, which is probably because of the limited amount of episodes (there's only 12), but then again, I'm not entirely certain this could've held my attention for 2 seasons - but only because I'm an action junkie. Most shows like this would've lost me a looong time ago...

I finished up Gravion (the first, 13 episode series) tonight. A prerty standard "super robot" type show, and though it was nothing remarkable, I had a fun enough time with it, and will check out the sequel in due time.

@CanisWolfred, really!? Only 3-7 chapters left (for Bleach)! Geez, for an arc that's been as dragged out as long as this one has been, that seems like a pretty abrupt timeline for the big final battle, IMO.

Even accounting for the chapters already spent showing Ichigo VS Ywach (5 or 6?), that doesn't seem much longer than the timeframe spent on some of the underlings. Heck, they spent at least 7-8 chapters showcasing the fight against Stern Ritter "M" (where Kenpachi revealed his Bankai, & Toshiro's evolved), which hadn't been resolved when they jumped to the big fight, then they just decide to end it quickly by having Ywach re-absorb "M's" power, so they can get this final battle underway (man, I poorly explained that...).

Yeah, so I've heard. I guess Kubo dragged things out too long, and now he has to rush, unless the final volume is more like an omnibus...

Source

Bleach had a perfect place to end years ago, after Aizen's defeat (relatively since even by then the series wasn't too good). At this point Bleach has just been dragging its corpse around for far too long, I'm glad there will be a space open in WSJ for a potential new series.

Also - after Bleach's impending end was announced 2 weeks ago, I decided to follow these last few chapters out of morbid curiosity. I watched, maybe, the first 50-ish episodes back when I was a fledgling anime fan, and I know the jist of what's happened just by virtue of being in this community, so I thought it might be fun just to see how this falling titan tries to clean itself up.

sees Digi:

Ah we can't all be fans of the Otaku-Jesus aesthetic I guess lol - oh well. To each his own. Personally Digi's up there with SuperBunnyhop & Jim Sterling as my favorite youtubers.

I don't know who this Digi guy is, but if he's in the same class as Jim Sterling and SuperBuns....well, let's just say we don't share the same tastes in talking heads, and leave it at that.

So this comes about ten years late, but I've finally finished Death Note! Hooray! I started watching it about 5 or 6 years ago, and got about half way through, but then the person I'd been watching with (who had all the DVDs) watched the remaining episodes all in one go, and I never ended up borrowing them to watch for myself.

I started again from the beginning recently, and then binged my way - somewhat unhealthily - to the end. I suppose I've 'got closure on it'. Inevitably, I developed some sort of emotional investment in the characters and narrative when I was younger, which was never concluded, so I've had the story hanging around half finished in my mind for a very long time. In a very small way, it feel like I've tied up some memories from that time, which is nice. It's like a piece of food you've put down half eaten somewhere - you become kind of strangely conscious of it's 'un-eaten-ness' until you find it and gobble down the rest.

Anyway, if I'd not seen it any of it before, I don't think I probably would recommend it to myself now. It starts off compellingly enough, with the whole thing feeling super tight and thrilling. It's impressive how they create such a sense of scale despite using a relatively small cast of characters and locations - just a few elements, but tied up in a really clever way. The relationships feel more compelling too; Light and Ryuk's dialogue is genuinely meaningful (and sometimes even funny), and all the connections between the other characters feel genuine and intruiging - all for the more considering the deception that keeps them only a hair's breadth from utter collapse.

But then the middle gets kind of flaccid, and after that the show gets into a habit of introducing new characters who basically just turn up to be knocked down and fill up some screen time. The claustrophobic atmosphere gets replaced with a lot more jet-setting, and many relationships get abandoned almost entirely. Light's sister gets pretty much no spoken dialogue in her appearance as generic hostage fodder, and Light's Mum is pretty much dropped completely - we don't get to see how either of them react to the events by that befall their family, despite them once being pretty main characters in the story (if only in a passive way). Ryuk and Light's dialogue gets pretty much abandoned too, which is a pity, as that was one of the few open and genuine relationships in the entire entire story, and let us see Light in a position where he wasn't outright top dog. After that, all we see is 'Light the Criminal Mastermind Mwahahahaha' (who answers to no one), which grows a bit tiring.

Anyway, I won't waffle on any longer. I'm sure most people here got sick of reading 'problems with Death Note' posts some time back in the late 2000s. Sorry. But anyway, I'm happy to have finally laid it to rest. : )

tbh, I just have nothing to add about Death Note that dozens of people couldn't put 1000 times better, much as I enjoyed it.

Well, except that I'm baffled to this day that in a series that is about Light's slow descent into power and evil that it is so willing to showcase Light as a maniacal laughing villain by the end of the very first episode. I never got that, felt like it was really jumping the gun.

@Maxz I was crazy about Death Note back in the day, it was one of the first anime I watched back in 2011. I remember it really excited me in a way that nothing had before, I was completely engrossed. In hindsight, I think that one of the series biggest strengths is how well it makes the viewer feel smart. The story and twists aren't really as complicated as the show makes them feel, but it certainly makes them feel highly complex. It makes the viewer feel as if they're following along with these genius-level intellects in a deadly mind game. As a 13 year old at the time, who like most immature young teens felt smart, (& was likely pretentious on some level) it was the perfect show for me. I loved the show to death, though I'm not sure how much I'd like it now. I'm sure it's still a good show, but it probably was a bit of a time & place thing for me.

The director, Tetsurou Araki, seems very skilled at crafting anime with perhaps the most mainstream appeal possible, having directed both Death Note and Attack on Titan, two of the biggest hits in the industry worldwide. Having seen most of both shows, I would say that's skill in his directorial ability to make events feel huge & important all the time, kind of like a more refined & talented Michael Bay in a sense.

@Caniswolfred While I can Jim Sterling being kind of divisive among people, (his crass and mock-egotistical humor & shtick definitely have a potential to wear or rebuff, I personally love him for the type of info & opinions he gives, & like his humor, but I can see issues some might have) but what's you're dislike with SuperBunnyhop, if I may inquire? Also what sorts of youtubers are you a fan of?

@Rocko52 Yeah, I completely understand. It's got a killer combination of edgy (but not completely overwrought) aesthetic, genuinely nail-biting scenarios, and smart scene composition that brings the psychological elements to the fore. To it's credit, I think it actually does come up with some rather nifty situations (compared to a lot of shows), but it spells these out so clearly and blatantly that they're largely impossible NOT to follow, so you always end up feeling super clever rather than super stupid or confused. In fact, pretty much everything is spelled out to the letter; all of the characters have blatant ticks or visual cues that are anything but subtle, but this generally only makes the aesthetic even stronger.

When most hormonally-supercharged teenage fantasies were realised with swords, robots and ninja powers, it must've felt so cool to be into a show that focused on exerting a suddenly inherited divine power through brains rather than brawn, and to use it in outsmarting the entire world. The fact that Light was able to carry out his divine judgment from his (mysteriously soundproof) bedroom must've also struck a chord with a lot of self-incarcerated teenagers, whether they realised it or not. It was the thinking man's show. If by man, we mean angst-ridden adolescent. Still, intoxicating stuff.

I think that aesthetic probably kept people satisfied enough to watch until the end, but I can't help feeling that are lot of other qualities end up petering out, or ended up being imitated less successfully later on.

With regards to YouTubers (I know this wasn't directed at me), I generally find the whole medium a bit too exposed and overwrought - it seems very easy for things to flare up, and the resulting controversy often becomes part of 'the brand', which then go on to inform later videos. I think I prefer my opinions through some sort of a filter, so I'm happy enough to watch NL's Alex in his role as big, fluffy presenter, but would be less inclined to watch if it were just "Welcome to the Alex Onley show, here are all my opinions of things". We get the odd soapbox, but normally he's got some purpose other than to tell you what he thinks about things. I used to watch a fair bit of vlogging, but I get turned off for some reason. Maybe it just felt a bit self indulgent... It's sort of the difference between, "hello, I have a purpose and am here to present something and carry it out", and "hello, me and my opinions are here to be entertainment in itself". I watched some of the earlier video, and thought he made some salient points, but I think I would have preferred to see it written down in a more compact piece of writing. There's no denying it's more emphatic to watch someone speaking their thoughts in the flesh, but... I don't know, I find if I spend too long doing it it feels oddly preachy. Maybe a Podcast would be a nice midground, with a couple of people involved - something to make it feel like you were more part of a conversation than listening to a sermon. But yeah, I'm very undecided. I mean the best way to get something across unfiltered IS obviously just to sit down and say it, which is exactly what these vlogs are.

@kkslider5552000 I think that the idea with Light was that he already a bit on the crazy side to begin with. He was an entitled, self-righteous, delusional kid who seemed to have a superiority-complex from the get go. Sometimes I wonder how so many Death Note fans rooted for such a monster, but then I remembered just how "relatable" that attitude is for some teens lol. I guess it helps that he's the main focus of the show, but as for me I was always an L fan.

@Maxz Yeah, whether it's really all that great or not, it's undeniable that Death Note has a lot done right in its production, considering how it's possibly one of THE most popular anime ever up, there with Bebop, Evangelion, FMA, Attack on Titan, and shudder SAO.

On the topic of youtubers, I tend to prefer analytic style videos. I'm not a huge fan of v-loggers, but Digibro is a bit of an exception. His regular videos aren't v-logs, they're focused videos on various aspects of anime and occasionally manga, sometimes analyzing different series, styles, aesthetics directors, studios, etc. It's great stuff, far more in-depth and intelligent than most anime youtubers. (while I sometimes like others, most of them are very surface-level anime reviewers) His v-logs are on a separate channel, and usually I just listen to them in the background while I do other stuff. He's quite possibly my favorite youtuber.

I like SuperBunnyhop for similar reasons, he (and Errant Signal both) take in-depth looks at different game related topics. He occasionally reviews things, but it's never right after release, he takes his time and really digs into the game its mechanics, themes, etc. Just another guy with really well thought out videos.

I do follow quite a variety of games youtubers off and on, several of whom are more of the reviewer type, but Jim Sterling is another stand-out for me. He tends to be quite divisive, because of his colorfully crass approach as well as his over-the-top egomaniac persona, (in reality he's actually quite the humble dude, not that you'd know that from his main video series) however I enjoy his style & especially appreciate the topics he covers. Unlike my other favorites, he's not an analysist as much as a journalist. He covers gaming news and stories quite in-depth, and with a very opinionated mindset. I don't always agree with him, but he's always entertaining and helps to keep me aware of the various going-ons in the world of gaming. I also like his written reviews from time to time, (he doesn't do video reviews) and he's even helped me find some games I might have otherwise skipped, like Silent Hill Downpour and Deadly Premonition. So that's that lol.

(Another fantastic youtuber is YourMovieSucksDOTorg - I won't keep going don't worry lol)

Here's also a neat little video by Digibro on the topic of Gundam, Yoshiyuki Tomino, and Reconguista in G.

@Caniswolfred I've always meant to get around to Gundam, and it's one of the major anime franchises that I knew a bit about before I actually got into anime. I think I might have talked to you about this years back, (off and on I've heavily looked into several of the shows, but never really started one) but I'm wondering this - If I want to watch the original Mobile Suit Gundam, should I watch the trilogy or the tv series? The trilogy was made later, apparently has much tighter pacin,g and some re-animated elements, overall it sounds better. That said, is there much character or plot development missed from the series? For a while I've been a fairly certain I'd watch the trilogy & then watch the Zeta Gundam series, as I've heard that the trilogy just makes for a better narrative, and cuts out parts of the show that were less tonally relevant or filler-ish. You're the local Gundam expert, so I was curious what you have to say about it.

My vague Gundam plans have always been to watch the UC stuff first, at the very least the original 3 Tomino shows, and maybe the various OVAs (War in the Pocket 08th MS Team etc) later, then figure out where Unicorn, Victory, Turn A, and Origin fit in the picture. Do you have any major suggestions? (Don't worry, animation age is not at all an issue for me, I've watched some anime older than Gundam at this point, so dated visual/movements don't turn me off at all)

I'm not sure how interested I am in the AU Gundam series. I know SEED and Wing were very popular, though I'm not sure if I really need to watch them. I'm kind of interested in Fighter G Gundam both because of how ridiculous and fun its always sounded, and because I think (though really I have no idea) that's the show my model belonged to. (A Gundam model I got as a kid was what sparked my interested - I also got a few Space Battleship Yamato ships as well) Besides the main UC series, I just don't really know what's good or not.

I'm not usually into anime, but I've started watching the Ace Attorney series on Crunchyroll because I love the games, and it's a lot of fun seeing them play out on a show. Are there any other games or maybe any other crossover things that have gotten the anime treatment? I know there are Zelda mangas, and watching these Ace Attorney shows make it seem to me like Professor Layton would be perfect for this kind of show.

@Rocko52 Honestly, I've never seen the movie trilogy. I'm told it's better, because it cuts out a lot of filler, but I always felt like the pacing was pretty good. It's 43 episodes, but I can only think of 3 episodes that ever felt "skippable" and one of them was never dubbed. So I'd be really surprised if the movies weren't rushed and/or skipped over a lot of important things.

My suggestion is to watch a few episodes, amd if you feel like it's dragging too much, switch to the movies. At the very least, as much as I love the original, Zeta Gundam is the more important watch out of the older series, with a much tighter story. Plus, I did see a few of the updated scenes in the third movie, at the very least, it seems like they put a lot of well-placed effort into the finale.

Oh, but do be warned that nearly every Gundam protagonist has to go through a "growing period". I mean, it's pretty standard coming-of-age stuff most of the time, but then there's Kamille in Zeta Gundam...well, I already talked at length about how puntable he was pretty much the entire show last week, but Amuro also starts out as a self-entitled twat, though at the very least him getting a big head is fairly believable considering how much pressure is put on him despite never being trained as a soldier (not to mention how much *** he kicks after a while). Kamille's just kind of an overly-emotional prick for no reason, proving every step of the way why teenagers should never be put in charge of 100-meter-tall mobile weaponry.

And that's not even getting into Gundam SEED and SEED Destiny. I highly recommend saving those for last if you ever really into Gundam, especially Destiny. At this point, I find both series to be more interesting to study than to watch - It's just so facinating how many ways it went wrong, and at times I wonder if they were supposed to be parodies of the first two Gundam series rather than homages, especially considering how much of the old conventions simply hold the story back. There were definitely some good ideas here and there, a lot of side characters and events that were either brushed to the side or underdeveloped; in fact, the side story manga seemed to have way more going on in them despite supposedly being behind the scenes, ultimately making the main story feel like a B-plot in comparison...basically, the worst part of the Gundam SEED universe were the TV series.

...but I'm already rambling...point is, start with the first series, unless you feel like the monster-of-the-day framework doesn't do it for ya. Then I'd recommend the movie trilogy, even if it's just to get the set up for Zeta Gundam and the OVAs out of the way, since those are the best parts of the Universal Century timeline. After that, you're free to pick and choose. ZZ Gundam is almost completely forgotten - its only animated call-back is in Gundam Unicorn, even Char's Counterattack barely treats it as a footnote, despite taking place soon afterwards chronologically, so it's technically skippable. Almost all the others are Self-Contained, except for a few obvious sequels, like Gundam Wing: Endless Waltz, or SEED Destiny.

@Xyphon22
I recall the Professor Layton movie being really good. If you want other Video Game adaptions, definitely try the Danganronpa anime, Persona 4: The Animation, and Devil Survivor 2 (they skipped adapting the first one, and yet insisted on leaving the 2 in title for some reason). And obviously the Tales series adapts well to anime, with Tales of the Abyss being my personal favorite.

@Caniswolfred Thanks! For whatever reason I had always thought Amuro was the lead of both MSG & Zeta, I probably assumed it lol. Unless he dies, I'd guess he still has a role to play though. With ZZ I've always known it was a black sheep for the franchise, and kind of an odd-ball for Tomino, considering the first half is comedy - despite all that I always had regarded it as a somewhat important third act, (MSG - Zeta - ZZ) but now I know that if it doesn't click it's not a crime to skip. Although a lot of the OVAs take place between Zeta & MSG, I think I'll save those for after Char's Counterattack. (Which again, I kind of have always seen as the cumulative cap on those first 3 series, since I haven't actually seen any I'm sure these labels are a bit preemptive lol)

With the AU stuff - Wing seems like it might be decent - but the more I here about the likes of SEED, AGE, and Build Fighters, the less interested I am. While bad anime are always interesting to analyze, they aren't often fun to watch, so unless I get neck-deep into Gundam I really don't foresee myself messing with them. It seems like the vast majority of the good stuff is in the UC.

It's also hard to say why, but for some reason I think I'll really like Turn A Gundam. It's definitely pre-mature, but something about its allegedly odd-pace, aesthetic, and kind of unorthodox setting really fascinate me. In any case, I'll definitely start with the original series either this week, or maybe after I get back from my trip. (Starting this Saturday I'll be gone for a week) Thanks for the advice!

@Rocko52 I still liked the second half ZZ Gundam - in fact, it does more than enough to make up for the faults for the beginning, with Judah and the Neo-Zeon rejects having some of the most impressive growth I've ever seen. It didn't even all that forced or anything, either, it's almost like they had planned for it (but I'm pretty sure there was a directorial and writing staff change partway through).

Also, don't expect a reasonably-paced movie from Char's Counterattack. Just thought I'd throw that out there.

EDIT:

Oh, and the AU stuff isn't all bad, it's just that the ones that were bad were offensively bad, so they work their way into the discussion more often than not. Turn A Gundam, Gundam X, Iron-Blooded Orphans, G-Gundam, and arguably Gundam 00 are actually really fantastic, as well as self-contained, so don't skip those. Gundam Wing I have too much nostalgia for, but I still think it has enough redeeming factors to make it enjoyable to watch. And honestly, if you can tolerate Kira Yamato's self-rightious hypocricy, as well as a ton of reused beamspam animation (and the same breast jiggle scene over 30 times, I counted!), Gundam SEED is a pretty decent watch on its own. It's still C- material, mind you, and SEED Destiny basically has no reason to exist, but it's about the worst the series gets. Build Fighters is dumb, shameless advertising on the level of Yu-Gi-Oh, but...there's a reason people still like Yu-Gi-Oh. I don't know what that is, and I hope it's not life-threatening or contagious, but at least it still warrants merit.

And despite what I've said about Gundam AGES and G-Reco, they're only frustrating to me because I feel like they were really, really close to being something great, but then they missed the mark and broke a watermain. Especially Reconguista in G: if its main cast actually had some agency in the story, or at least weren't horribly insufferable, it would've been a pretty great show. The mecha battles were great, the side characters were well-developed, and there was obviously a good plot and a rich setting deep down in there. It just needed better tour guides to showcase it.

As for AGES, at the very least, there are quite a few good parts to its story here and there, and if you haven't watched a million mecha series by now, you might not be able predict every major plot point from start to finish by the end of episode 10 like I did.

Alright, sorry to double-post but I just decided to watch episode 1 of Mobile Suit Gundam and it was a very good choice. That was actually a really great first episode. I've known the basic conflict the series opens on for a while now, but it was another thing to see it in action. The Zeon Zakus, White Base, and the titular Mobile Suit are all familiar to me thanks, to their iconic status, but the overall design of Side 7 and the technology were all very neat too. I must say that surpassed my expectations, I knew it would be good, but I think the infamous animation's quality actually impressed me, (it definitely feels old but, not really in a negative way, I like how it looked & felt) not to mention the episode really hit the points it had to well.

Gundam is renowned for tackling themes of war, and this show is firing on all cylinders from the start. We got to see names and faces on both sides of the conflict, although obviously our empathy is with the Federation for now. Amuro & Fran's reaction to the immediate death of all those around them was also handled very well, I barely know the characters and it still had an impact. By the time Amuro got into the Gundam, I felt the tension was palpable and I couldn't wait to see him tear the Zaku in half. (Although, did that explosion inadvertently kill his father? lol) In any case, for a series that's often called dated in a bad way, I thought that first episode was really impressive and has made me even more excited to start Gundam. I won't keep posting for every episode, but I think I will watch one more before I go to sleep.

@Caniswolfred I've heard very mixed things about Char's Counterattack. Back when I first heard about it years ago, it sounded like it was set up to be a big finale to the UC up to that point, and of course I didn't look much more into it. More recently I've read some rather mixed things about it, but also some higher praises. I guess I''ll just keep my expectations tempered and adjusted - I should probably think of it as just another UC story rather than a big conclusion to avoid disappointment lol.