I don't think Smash Bros. for DS would make much sense from a business standpoint. Obviously, handhelds sell much more than home consoles do. While that would allow a large install base from the beginning, it wouldn't convince many people to buy a DS since most people that have it want it, no? Now, if they released a Smash Bros. game for Wii, that would fuel console sales and indirectly earn them much more money than releasing a DS game. Besides, with the size restrictions in a DS game,they could exactly pack a lot of content in it like they would with a console release. They'd have to cut down on modes, characters, stages, etc. and the console installment would be undeniably better from not having these restrictions.
Even if you say this, a Smash Bros DS done right would generate REDICULOUS amount of sales. And considering the reduced amount of development costs might be a nice incentive for Nintendo.
Say theoretically, a Wii Smash Bros sold 1,000,000 copies. That would be $50,000,000. A DS title selling the same would only produce $35,000,000. That's a $15,000,000 loss for every one million copies they sell. In terms of fueling system sales, think about it like this. Say users ONLY buy the DSi (the most expensive DS model), which is $170 (which in reality wouldn't happen, some would pick up a DS Lite). If they sold 1 million copies, that's $170,000,000. The Wii would give $250,000,000. An $80,000,000 loss.
In total, that's a $95,000,000 loss for every million copies sold to newcomers. Nintendo, being a company (which like nearly every other company seeks money) wouldn't want to lose that methinks.
instead of comparing it to wii sales they think about the money that they would get from it. you talk about what they wont get instead of what they will get
... lots of text In total, that's a $95,000,000 loss for every million copies sold to newcomers. Nintendo, being a company (which like nearly every other company seeks money) wouldn't want to lose that methinks.
Forgetting even the most important factor of all, Wii already has a SSB which means that most people who would buy a Wii only for the game has already done so. Which means that market is already filled, that leaves the DS. Suddenly your numbers mean nothing.
There he goes, Firkraag. One of God's own prototypes. A high-powered mutant of some kind never even considered for mass production. Too weird to live, and too rare to die. - My VGscore
That doesn't change the fact that if we're talking Consoles + Games sold DS will win over the Wii no questions asked. Besides, what you mention about the DS lifespan holds true for the Wii as well. Also, those who has SSB for wii and didn't like it will probably go and buy the new Wii game as much as they would a new DS game. Throw in a few DSi exclusive DLC or features and you'll probably convert quite a few DS Lite/Vanilla SSB fans to the DSi as well, this is only for good measure though it's not like it will need it to outsell anyways.
I can't believe i'm debating this, SSB DS would generate more revenue then another Wii iteration of the game any day of the week, period.
Edit: I reserve myself for any error i might have should the game actually come out and sell like a horse shit since we're only talking theory anyways.
There he goes, Firkraag. One of God's own prototypes. A high-powered mutant of some kind never even considered for mass production. Too weird to live, and too rare to die. - My VGscore
I would expect a Smash Bros. for the DS to sell no more than 18 million, as New Super Mario Bros has reached that (and it came out in 2006). Let's say Nintendo decided to release ANOTHER Smash game for the Wii with several new improvements that all people will love (which is as likely as the DS getting DLC). The Wii game sells 13 million over its lifespan, the DS sells 18 million. DS gets $630,000,000, Wii gets $650,000,000. Also say that 1,500,000 users buy a Wii and 2,000,000 buy a DSi. Wii gets $375,000,000 while DSi gets $340,000,000
Once again, a loss of money. Regardless, the Wii earns more profit.
While 2 million could possibly go out and buy a DS, I doubt 1,5 million would go out and buy the wii for the same reasons I noted in my second to last previous post. The SSB fans who wants the game for wii has probably already bought a Wii with the game already, that market is tapped.
The DS on the other hand still has an untapped market for SSB fans who does not own the hand held. So in conclusion I would put the ratio closer too 1/4 Wii/DS if not more sold in regards to getting the game + console.
Also how many Wii+SSB owners will buy a second wii to play a second game? NONE. How many would upgrade their DS to DSi for added features and DLC? Probably not a lot, but enough to beat ZERO. Mind you the value of upgrading a DS to a DSi outside of SSB is greater then that of owning 2 Wii consoles.
There he goes, Firkraag. One of God's own prototypes. A high-powered mutant of some kind never even considered for mass production. Too weird to live, and too rare to die. - My VGscore
Yeah so everyone who buys it for the wii will go out and buy 3 wiimotes and 4 classic controllers the minute they get this game, this is assuming EVERYONE of those 500, 000 people can afford such a purchase or have enough friends to warrant them.
I'm done arguing with a calculator. Your bile of random numbers mean as I already said, nothing. There's too many factors to include, and you'r not even taking half of them.
There he goes, Firkraag. One of God's own prototypes. A high-powered mutant of some kind never even considered for mass production. Too weird to live, and too rare to die. - My VGscore
Two can play this game, i'll assume that every kid who gets that wii with 4 controllers and all those accessories will spend the same amount of money on future DS game purchases which nullifies your argument that a premium price equals extra revenue. I'll also assume that for every future wii game bought @ 60$ the DS owner will buy 2 DS games @ 30$ each.
Now take into consideration that while the wii+SSB market is much less than the DS+SSB market why with a SSB game already been out for the wii for a long time and we'll see a profit hmm, let's keep the number we had before with 1,5 million DS buyers to 500k Wii buyers.
300,000,000$ per 2 million units moved. That wasn't so hard, assuming and whipping up numbers is sure fun.
There he goes, Firkraag. One of God's own prototypes. A high-powered mutant of some kind never even considered for mass production. Too weird to live, and too rare to die. - My VGscore
Two can play this game, i'll assume that every kid who gets that wii with 4 controllers and all those accessories will spend the same amount of money on future DS game purchases
May I ask why this is? That is a very large assumption your argument is riding on.
Oh wait, now we're getting a reality check? You sure?
If so, let's get back to the assumption that the fans will get a Wii+SSB or a DS+SSB the bare minimum and not assume they can afford/want to get anything else for it as that's highly speculative(word?). Because your assumption that every kid with a wii will get all those accessories is about as probable as the kid buying DS games for that same amount is.
There he goes, Firkraag. One of God's own prototypes. A high-powered mutant of some kind never even considered for mass production. Too weird to live, and too rare to die. - My VGscore
Do keep in mind that people will likely be buying handhelds because they are cheaper than consoles and as such not spending as much as they would on Wii. Would the average person accumulate that amount of DS games?
For the sake of the argument it's safest not to assume the Wii owner is willing to spend more money on gaming than the DS owner and as such only count the initial and bare minimum required for both setups.
Good point as well, Brawl is 8 GB large while the biggest DS game so far is 128 MB, with far inferior capabilities. Makes it tough to make a game like Smash on.
You did not just go there, really? Can they fit a 40 hour RPG on there, they sure as hell can fit 30 fighters on 20 stages.
There he goes, Firkraag. One of God's own prototypes. A high-powered mutant of some kind never even considered for mass production. Too weird to live, and too rare to die. - My VGscore
Fine, you may want to assume stuff like wealth of DS owners as opposed to Wii owners, leave me out of it though. Anyone else feel free to pick up where I left off. But not without a recap:
Economic gain for Nintendo with New Wii SSB vs a DS SSB: My argument: SSB fans who wants to get a wii+SSB has probably already done so, they might buy the new game but they won't buy a second console. That market is tapped, running on fumes and so on the demand for this product has filled. The DS on the other hand still has a demand that has not been met, resulting in more units moved and hand-helds sold because of it.
zss_shadows argument: it's basically that the wii game would be more expensive therefore generating more revenue. it's also of his belief that while adding nothing to the issue at hand buyers of the wii even faced with 1/4 or lesser odds against the DS will buy enough accessories to make up for the difference in units sold in. He also like to add to this argument by saying that average Wii owners has more money to spend on games and accessories than the average DS owner which will even it out even more.
Did I forget anything?
Thanks for a good run, we managed to avoid namecalling and that's always good. But I have grown tired of this back and forth arguing that has lead to nothing more then wasted time seeing as nobody was able to convince the other.
There he goes, Firkraag. One of God's own prototypes. A high-powered mutant of some kind never even considered for mass production. Too weird to live, and too rare to die. - My VGscore
I think all the simultanious action that happens in the true SSB experience is probably a whole lot to handle on the limited capabilities of the Nintendo DS. But if evrything is done in sprites i think it should be possible.
well... Gta Chinatown wars has the entire city from GTA 4 in it. That is much more challenging imo than moving that many characters from brawl to ds ssb. Let's not forget that Chinatownwars has amazing review scores and is currently the highest ranked ds game. This game isn't some scaled down version of the other GTA games nor is it a rip off. It's a unique game in it's own right.
I think the same would be for SSB DS. At first glance (like gta) it will seem inferior in the pictures. This wouldn't be a bad game becuase nintendo knows what they are doing when it comes to Smash. I'm not yet done squeezing the life out of Brawl yet, I want SSB DS because it would be portable. of course there are other reasons and I'm sure this wouldn't be the only good feature but it would be the most obvious. I mean, who wouldn't want to play Smash anywhere?
awww man i wanted to debate more! i had to leave early yesterday!.....well anyways, the wii already had a smash bros and plus how can you compare console sales with handheld ones? thats dumb when obviously the console and its games will cost more. of course wii would have more sales. nintendo knows that the ds/dsi will not outsell ds systems or games. they just want sales not more sales then the wii....case closed
this is an email i sent nintendo. they did not accept it for legal reasons but if any game developer comes across it.... PLEASE PLEASE MAKE THIS GAME I AM BEGGING YOU!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! I would like to reqeust (and i am probably not the first) a super smash bros. ds game. i did a little data studying and heres what i came up with. an average n64 cartridge held 128 megabits a ds cartridge holds about the same amount. the ds might have a better graphics generator then an n64. thus, you could make a ds adaption of this game with different people and stages but still have the same feel of super smash bros. i suggest you use the graphics from new super mario bros. for mario. you should use the graphics from phantom hourglass for link. have mr. game and watch in the pre order special edition (like in brawl). also have a nintendo entertainment system style character in the pre order special(such as Q-bert or nes mario). you could which i think is a pretty good idea, put it into the dsiware shop or make it dsi enhanced to have a bit of better graphics. try using a 3-D style platform besides the usual hand drawn style of graphics that ds ususally has in games. for some stages put the ghost ship from phantom hourglass, a section of the first level from new super mario brothers. take the ame marios cement factory from game and watch since it seems fitted for the game for mr. game and watch. these are simply ideas to start it off so if you end up making this game, add more(obviously)! oh yeah, make it wi-fi compatible
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Topic: Why no...Smash Bros. DS
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