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Topic: Samurai Warriors Chronicle Sequel

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Rockgamer

They are utterly terrible compared to the Japanese original track though. Perhaps it's just because I understand Japanese.

That definitely makes you the exception then, as most people who complain about dubs (not just in Warriors games, but in general) don't even speak the original language but still like to think they know all the fine nuances of it.

But when it comes to me personally, I'd rather have a mediocre dub in a language I understand than have an excellent original audio track in a language I don't. At least when it comes to video games, where I'm going to be busy enough looking at other stuff (maps, health gauges, etc.) that I don't want to have to spend time reading extra info via text that can be given to me audibly. As I said before, it's really a matter of personal preference, so it's just a bad portend that TK is starting to take away that choice from those of us that do prefer it (however small in numbers we may be ).

No, but it's historically abstracted. That is to say, with the Warriors games (and this goes for Dynasty Warriors, too), they've taken the real histories behind these people, and turned them into traits that allow them to wade into an enemy army of 1000 or so and survive. There is surprisingly little pure fantasy in the games though.

Let me give you an example: Shingen Takeda wields a butterfly fan, correct? That's a pretty strange weapon to have, but in real history, Shingen's most famous battle was going really badly. So badly a couple of enemy soldiers had got into camp. Shingen didn't have time to get a real weapon, but he managed to beat them off with his fan, and the battle started to turn from there. That fan has become emblematic, and therefore it's put into the game.

Kanbei Kuroda was a pretty nasty man, but a tactical genius. Answer? Make him a dark magic using dude.

If you research (proper research, not just Wikipedia) these characters from history you'll realise that, unlike Basara, in the Warriors games almost everything is done for a reason. It's abstracted, but it's based on real history. While you're right to say they're not comprehensive histories of the time periods, they are, largely, correct histories.

This doesn't include Warriors Orochi, obviously, because that's more like The Avengers - bring awesome characters together and you get even more awesome than before.

No matter how abstract they try to make it, it still doesn't change the fact that some of it is not historically accurate at all. I love pummeling down the battlefield with a deck of cards, but there's no way it's historically accurate (or even realistic) and it's campy as all get out. I play video games for fun first and foremost, so I guess I just don't see camp as a bad thing. And playing DW did get me genuinely interested in the time period, which is why I took some Asian history classes back when I was in college. So while the games do an alright job of portraying a general sense of what happened during the time period, it's still nowhere near the equivalent of cracking open a book (but that's not as fun).

Rockgamer

Bankai

No matter how abstract they try to make it, it still doesn't change the fact that some of it is not historically accurate at all. I love pummeling down the battlefield with a deck of cards, but there's no way it's historically accurate (or even realistic) and it's campy as all get out. I play video games for fun first and foremost, so I guess I just don't see camp as a bad thing. And playing DW did get me genuinely interested in the time period, which is why I took some Asian history classes back when I was in college. So while the games do an alright job of portraying a general sense of what happened during the time period, it's still nowhere near the equivalent of cracking open a book (but that's not as fun).

I think you're missing the point. Abstraction does not mean "camp." Basara is camp. Warriors are abstract. It comes down to intent. Basara, being based on a Manga, tries (and fails, mind you, I hate Basara) to be over-the-top, funny, and explosive. The Warriors games are based on history. The intent of those games is to give people a chance to be a heroic personality on a very famous battlefield. It's one of the reasons that the Warriors games don't resonate so well in the West - most people haven't got a clue who Nobunaga Oda is, let alone the likes a Masamune Date or Shingen Takeda.

There's abstraction because it would be rather boring in a game context to have to read a 20 page into to understand why the character you're about to take control of is a hero. Tecmo Koei has made an art form of putting the personalities of the heroes into the avatars, the weapons they wield, and a few short cut scenes.

As for the historical accuracy - the characters are a reasonably accurate reflection of their historical counterparts. Again, abstracted, but that's artistic license, not a breach of historical accuracy. Think of it like the paintings of Jesus. No one knows what Jesus actually looked like, so artists over the years have interpreted what they know of the man to create an abstract image of him. It's still historically accurate in the sense that it's a reflection of the real Jesus.

But none of that is camp. Things only get camp when the dub happens.

Edited on by Bankai

Rockgamer

ChocoGoldfish wrote:

I think you're missing the point. Abstraction does not mean "camp." Basara is camp. Warriors are abstract. It comes down to intent. Basara, being based on a Manga, tries (and fails, mind you, I hate Basara) to be over-the-top, funny, and explosive. The Warriors games are based on history. The intent of those games is to give people a chance to be a heroic personality on a very famous battlefield. It's one of the reasons that the Warriors games don't resonate so well in the West - most people haven't got a clue who Nobunaga Oda is, let alone the likes a Masamune Date or Shingen Takeda.

There's abstraction because it would be rather boring in a game context to have to read a 20 page into to understand why the character you're about to take control of is a hero. Tecmo Koei has made an art form of putting the personalities of the heroes into the avatars, the weapons they wield, and a few short cut scenes.

As for the historical accuracy - the characters are a reasonably accurate reflection of their historical counterparts. Again, abstracted, but that's artistic license, not a breach of historical accuracy. Think of it like the paintings of Jesus. No one knows what Jesus actually looked like, so artists over the years have interpreted what they know of the man to create an abstract image of him. It's still historically accurate in the sense that it's a reflection of the real Jesus.

But none of that is camp. Things only get camp when the dub happens.

I'm not saying abstract equals camp, I'm saying that interpreting things in an abstract way still doesn't necessarily make them historically accurate. But the completely historically accurate and realistic Warriors game would not be a fun Warriors game, so they add other elements that help to make the games fun and accessible. I consider some of those things campy, and no amount of dissection of the artistic liberties they've taken with their abstractions is going to change that.

As for Sengoku Basara, yes it uses wildly exaggerated versions of people, places and events of that time, but it doesn't change the fact that it's still based on those historical elements. Yes it's probably the loosest basis you could possibly think of, but still a basis nonetheless. Also, I'm pretty sure it's not based on a manga (as far as I know the games were created first and everything else was spun off of those).

And I've watched plenty of cutscenes that would be considered campy no matter what language they were in (and I'm not just talking about some of the hilarious ending videos they used to have either). Yes they're based on history, but that doesn't mean it isn't portraying an over-dramatized account of the actual events. It just seems like you're taking these games even more seriously than Tecmo Koei does. I remember watching the press conference where they revealed more info about DW7 and they had a bunch of comedians come out and play the game. And let's not forget all of the goofy DLC they've released for some of the games (considering how well it sells, people must like adding these silly elements into their game). Is it it really that bad that the games have some fun, campy elements in them? You can still get a nice historic overview from playing the games, but to accept them as being wholly historically accurate and devoid of any camp is probably doing yourself a disservice.

Rockgamer

KromCompany

i dont know, bu think mine is broken. everyone looks like they are chewing gum

3ds FC: 2921-9956-8417

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