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Topic: Anyone else opposed to Senran Kagura?

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PorridgeParlour

161. Posted:

My whole point is that it's silly to think SK could not possibly be a stumbling block for a person. I don't feel that that opinion needs proof. It shouldn't offend people.

PorridgeParlour

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Blast

162. Posted:

CaviarMeths wrote:

Untitled

'Sup guys. Just dropping by with my socially acceptable degrading of a gender with my revealing outfits and unrealistic body image.

@CaviarMeths You win the thread.

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Ralizah

163. Posted:

PorridgeParlour wrote:

My whole point is that it's silly to think SK could not possibly be a stumbling block for a person. I don't feel that that opinion needs proof. It shouldn't offend people.

What do you mean by "stumbling block?" What's going to happen if a person plays it, exactly?

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Morphbug

164. Posted:

Ralizah wrote:

PorridgeParlour wrote:

My whole point is that it's silly to think SK could not possibly be a stumbling block for a person. I don't feel that that opinion needs proof. It shouldn't offend people.

What do you mean by "stumbling block?" What's going to happen if a person plays it, exactly?

I guess what he means is that the art style featured in the games could interest one or two individuals into seeking similar art in different places, like say... Looking up for fan art or more art from the same artists online, going from point A to point B, eventually culminating with the person walking right into Sodom and Gomorrah... Just a wild guess.

But anything could serve as a "starting point" in that case. Anything. But I guess his point is that this game could be a more direct link to that than, say, pet rocks.

Edited on by Morphbug

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CanisWolfred

165. Posted:

PorridgeParlour wrote:

My whole point is that it's silly to think SK could not possibly be a stumbling block for a person. I don't feel that that opinion needs proof. It shouldn't offend people.

The problem is that you suck at explaining your opinion. If you'd just take the time to express it in more detail, maybe we could understand your position, but you keep talking like it's obvious, which I know from personal experience is often just a way to hide the fact that you yourself don't quite understand your own position.

Doesn't talk about games.

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I-U

166. Posted:

I'm a fan of Senran Kagura Burst. I really don't have any issue with any woman having good-sized breasts and wearing a bikini top. I think it's more of an issue that people want to condemn an acceptance of one's sexuality. All of the characters in Senran have accepted that aspect of their character. They are both stronger for it (i.e. Frantic Mode) and more respectful in the sense they are comfortable with themselves. As far as the developer's values are concerned of women, when I play the game, the women showing portions of their breasts in their bikinis is in the back of my mind and the game itself puts those details in the back too. The emphasis with a fighter is fighting, and that holds true with this title. As far as I'm concerned, the developer views women as both strong and sexy, which I definitely support.

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Mickey

167. Posted:

CaviarMeths wrote:

Untitled

'Sup guys. Just dropping by with my socially acceptable degrading of a gender with my revealing outfits and unrealistic body image.

There's a certain C word that comes to mind when I read this post.

Cute.

It's cute that you seem to think that you're being clever with this post, it's cute that you use He-Man (a character that was made for little boys) as an example of objectification, and it's cute that you seem to completely misunderstand what objectification is. See, objectification is the degradation of a human being to a thing. That generally doesn't happen to male characters. Sure, they're presented as tall, muscular, heroic, and brave, but they're not things we're supposed to desire, and they're not our targets or goals. Their ideals are our goals, sure, but they themselves are not our goals. Or, in simpler terms: they're not objectified, they're idealized.

When women are objectified, we want them. When men are idealized, we want to be them.

There's a difference. Learn it.

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Super_Gravy

168. Posted:

@Mickey: I don't know about that. There is a lot of girls love He-Man series as well.

Umm… Care to have some gravy?

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Ralizah

169. Posted:

@Mickey
I get what you're saying, and, in general, tend to agree, but I've known enough gay guys in my life to say with confidence that plenty of little boys who were not of a heterosexual persuasion objectified He-Man quite a bit.

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Mickey

170. Posted:

@Super_Gravy @Ralizah That may be true, but the fact of the matter is: They didn't make He-Man look the way he does so they could titillate their female (or homosexual male) audience, they idealized him so little boys would want to be him and thus buy the toys so they could pretend they were. In fact, I doubt they even thought about a female (or homosexual male) audience in their show for little boys since this came out before The Big Brony Boom of 2010 (as I like to call it) and I don't need to explain why they didn't think about a homosexual male audience.

I hope that clears things up for both of you.

Edited on by Mickey

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Gioku

171. Posted:

@Mickey ...even so, the "Big Brony Boom" was pretty much unintended...

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shaneoh

172. Posted:

kkslider5552000 wrote:

For my own sanity, this is going to be my one post in this thread.

I'll limit myself to one reply tops.

These aren't women. These aren't people. There is no violence. There is no DNA. No trace of there ever being any form of sentience to these "characters." No cuts, broken bones or bruises. And no trauma to the "characters". They are bits of light which your brain chooses to organise and interpret as patterns. Case in point, the Playstation Logo:
Untitled
(this is just coincidentally a good example, no trolling)
Look at the logo and what do you see? The letters P and S? Why? The lower part of the arc doesn't intersect with the staff like in the letter P. How can we be sure the arc on the left and the arc on the right are connected with the red line "in front of it?" Could be completely blank. For that fact how can we tell each coloured segment of the "S" is connected, when they could easily be separate parts lined up very well next to each other?
If you had no knowledge of letters or the product, they would just be random lines. But because we do, the mind is filling in the blanks and makes those associations. It is exactly the same with any game, we connect the dots and get a picture of what we think we are seeing. Hell it's the same with any game of dot to dot, we connect them in what we think is the order by the numbering of the dots.

mikeymaster2001 wrote:

As for calling human sexuality THE fundamental aspect of human life, that's certainly an important part, but by no means is it the all-consuming, ever-present motivation some make it out to be. It can be controlled , and guided, like a bit and bridle on a horse, being led by the rider where HE wants it to go.

Too bad if a bit and bridle is one of your things. But saying "HE" is wrong, women are just as capable at having this addiction as men. But if a habit or desire needs to be controlled then it is an issue for THEM, not EVERYONE. What tempts one, may not tempt another.

Mickey wrote:

they idealized him so little boys would want to be him and thus buy the toys so they could pretend they were.

Wanting to be something and believing it's possible are two completely different things. One is fantasy, the other insanity.

Edited on by shaneoh

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Mickey

173. Posted:

@Gioku Unintended or not, it changed things (at least, in children's TV shows).

On-Topic: I'll refrain from posting here since I'm preposterously biased on this subject.

Bye. :)

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Gioku

174. Posted:

...this is probably my last post here, but...

...I just wanna say that I always find these sort of discussions to be a little weird. You see, I was raised to think that people are people — I don't make distinctions between people by skin color, or gender, or sexuality, or anything — to me people are just people. And this, I believe, has fueled my idea that people should be allowed to be who they are without letting anyone tell them they can't/what they're doing is wrong...

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mamp

175. Posted:

@Mickey
Untitled
so are these guys idealized? I'm pretty sure we know the real reason this movie was created. I don't even wanna describe how excited my 2 female friends were to see this movie they even told me what male body part they wanted to see.
EDIT: LMAO totally trolling! Last troll post on this discussion, I don't want TBD to get me. I don't imagine dragons I fear them XD (me and my lame puns)

Edited on by mamp

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LordJumpMad

176. Posted:

This thread
Untitled

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Mickey

177. Posted:

@mamp No, those guys are real-life actors that are human beings. Whereas He-Man is a fictional character that was created as an idealization of the Male gender.

Now, for real this time, GOODBYE.

EDIT: Oops, just got trolled. There's egg on my face now.

Edited on by Mickey

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CaviarMeths

178. Posted:

Mickey wrote:

When women are objectified, we want them. When men are idealized, we want to be them.

And the reverse is still 100% true. Both men and women are objectified in popular culture and both men and women have strong role models not bound by gender. Girls have male role models. Boys have female role models. Both boys and girls will at some point have curiosities and develop unrealistic expectations of sexual encounters. That's part of growing up.

(apologies for that completely irrelevant tangent)

But you're speaking for yourself here. This entire topic is about niche interests for a specific audience. Children's shows very commonly find an unintended audience for a variety of reasons, such as Sailor Moon, My Little Pony, Spongebob Squarepants, and even He-Man. If you think that He-Man was not the subject of objectification from both boys and girls, then I admire your ability to have made it this far into the internet unscathed. Congrats for sidestepping the He-Man/Skeletor yaoi fanfic.

There will be girls who play Senran Kagura Burst and find themselves idealizing or relating to the girls in the game. There will be just as many girls who will play the game and be titillated by the fanservice. Different strokes. But like boys, the vast majority of the girls who play this game will just laugh off the fanservice as what it's meant to be - a joke.

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Morphbug

179. Posted:

Isn't there a fad where girls (and some boys too, why not) actually permanently modify their bodies to look like unrealistic, totally uncanny valley material anime girls and dolls?

Edited on by Morphbug

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Stereoman

180. Posted:

Mickey wrote:

CaviarMeths wrote:

Untitled

'Sup guys. Just dropping by with my socially acceptable degrading of a gender with my revealing outfits and unrealistic body image.

There's a certain C word that comes to mind when I read this post.

Cute.

It's cute that you seem to think that you're being clever with this post, it's cute that you use He-Man (a character that was made for little boys) as an example of objectification, and it's cute that you seem to completely misunderstand what objectification is. See, objectification is the degradation of a human being to a thing. That generally doesn't happen to male characters. Sure, they're presented as tall, muscular, heroic, and brave, but they're not things we're supposed to desire, and they're not our targets or goals. Their ideals are our goals, sure, but they themselves are not our goals. Or, in simpler terms: they're not objectified, they're idealized.

When women are objectified, we want them. When men are idealized, we want to be them.

There's a difference. Learn it.

sorry but your answer is silly mickey. It sounds oh so quite intelligent to talk about ideal and object.

But u do realize he-man was a TOY franchise ? All the anime and comics were merchandising to sell TOYs to little boys. And no little boys didnt want to become little plastic pieces with movable arms or plastic swords. They wanted to HAVE those toys to play cause they were OBJECTS which obeyed their rule and fantasy in playing with them.
So your answer is arrogant , stupid and precocious. Shame on distort such a nice word like cute

Ps: i find this thread quite interesting and educative ( even though trolls come in with their stupidity and sarcastic world view )

ps2: good post Caviar.

Edited on by theblackdragon

Stereoman

Sorry, this topic has been locked.